Why should you use a spouted portafilter? - Page 4

Beginner and pro baristas share tips and tricks for making espresso.
Junior

#31: Post by Junior »

Great, now that I've read this thread and switched to the spouted portafilter for comparison, I can't get the metallic taste out of my mind. Regardless, I don't think I can give up the fun of watching the naked pours (along with the instant feedback) as well as the ease in cleanup. Watching the ooze from the spouts is great, but it doesn't tell me nearly as much as the timing and appearance of the initial beading and blonding patterns. Real or perceived differences in taste or mouth-feel aside, the total experience for me is better with the bottomless.
Michael

zin1953

#32: Post by zin1953 »

Junior wrote:Real or perceived differences in taste or mouth-feel aside, the total experience for me is better with the bottomless.
And that's what counts!
A morning without coffee is sleep. -- Anon.

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Illyfex

#33: Post by Illyfex »

AndyS wrote:That would be an interesting observation -- if it were true.

My measurements this morning:
Naked shot: 160F
Spouted shot: 155F

Thermal mass doesn't help if it's hanging out in the room temperature air.
It was not an observation, but a theory, subject to be proven or disproved. Of course, you have thermocouples at the grouphead and in the cup and ensured the starting temp in the head (and the cup) were all identical, right? How many runs were in the test? Did you randomize the pours between PF types? How long was each PF locked in before the shot was pulled? Was the dosing consistent? Etc. Just trying to determine if all of the variables were isolated...

Peaberry

#34: Post by Peaberry »

Junior wrote:Watching the ooze from the spouts is great, but it doesn't tell me nearly as much as the timing and appearance of the initial beading and blonding patterns.
That is a very interesting point. I remember that my first encounters with a bottomless portafilter were very disappointing. There was a great deal of information that I was accustomed to reading from the spouts in terms of the viscosity, speed, color, movement, undulation, bubbling, twisting, and stripe formation, that I was not able to read from the bottomless.

As it turns out, all of the same information that I could read off the spouts could also be read from the bottom of the basket. The trick is in knowing what you are seeing and how to interpret the visual cues. I can tell by the steam over the spouts exactly what is going on inside the portafilter. Likewise, I can tell by the bottom of the portafilter how it would flow over the spouts.

As far as the metallic taste; the exposed brass forms a layer of oxidation and coffee oil "seasoning" that will prevent metallic flavor. You have to straddle the line between seasoning and dirty, because you can get dirty portafilter taste as well.

In relation to heat retention, I don't think it is a bad thing for the espresso to cool off once it leaves the basket. A terribly hot shot is not that great on the palate. As long as it looses heat after the extraction, and not during, it is just cooling off to drinking temperature. Both the bottomless and the spouts do a great job of bringing the liquid down to a good temperature.

So my conclusion is that whether it be Boxers or Tighty-Whitey, it is simply a matter of personal preference. One is not necessarily better than the other.
Press On,
Peaberry

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Marshall

#35: Post by Marshall »

I don't think anyone has mentioned this, but the number one reason I use a spout (single) is to enjoy my drink without stressing about the perfection of the pour.

If there is a spritz or two, or the centredness of the cone is ten degrees off, or the stripes on the cone don't qualify for an espresso porn gallery, I DON'T WANT TO KNOW ABOUT IT! I can taste whether or not the shot was good, and I can see what, if anything, needs to be corrected in the stream coming out of the spout.
Marshall
Los Angeles

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Psyd

#36: Post by Psyd »

Marshall wrote:I DON'T WANT TO KNOW ABOUT IT! I can taste whether or not the shot was good.
Marshall, I am so glad that I wasn't enjoying a cappa right about then! ; > It's hell to get that stuff outta my keyboard!

I couldn't agree more. OTOH, I've already taken up the CDO habit of wiping down the machine after each session and drinking nearly every mistake as a learning tool, punishment tool, and because I'm just that lazy sometimes.

But yeah, sometimes I just lie to me and tell me that it'll all be alright! ; >
Espresso Sniper
One Shot, One Kill

LMWDP #175

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AndyS

#37: Post by AndyS »

Illyfex wrote:It was not an observation, but a theory, subject to be proven or disproved. Of course, you have thermocouples at the grouphead and in the cup and ensured the starting temp in the head (and the cup) were all identical, right? How many runs were in the test? Did you randomize the pours between PF types? How long was each PF locked in before the shot was pulled? Was the dosing consistent? Etc. Just trying to determine if all of the variables were isolated...
Dave, it's your theory. You're welcome to knock yourself out researching it.

Me, I gave it one try: a single pair of shots, and to be honest, I have zero interest in pursuing it further.
-AndyS
VST refractometer/filter basket beta tester, no financial interest in the company

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Psyd

#38: Post by Psyd »

Peaberry wrote: In relation to heat retention...
So my conclusion is that whether it be Boxers or Tighty-Whitey, it is simply a matter of personal preference. One is not necessarily better than the other.
Testicular health, and reproductive motility on sperm care, at least according to my urologist buddy (who is insisting that I challenge this 'myth' after I introduced him to H-B).
All else being equal, boxer wearers have more boy children.
I have no dog in this fight (literally, I've chosen neither, and had the plumbing disconnected) but I did want to point out that the analogy may be more apt than the author intended.
One may not be better than the other unless you take into account, and care a bit, about the subtle differences between the two.
Espresso Sniper
One Shot, One Kill

LMWDP #175

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BradyButler

#39: Post by BradyButler »

I've often wondered why we expect a spouted portafilter to "retain the heat" of brewed espresso. We know that conduction is a great way to transfer heat. We know that the spouts are cooler than the espresso dropping from the bottom of the basket. We know that brass is an awesome conductor of heat. Why then should the spouts not cool the espresso?

Seems to me like the best way to retain the heat in the shot is to not let it touch anything. Thanks for posting a set of observations (quick as they were) on this Andy.

All that said, I personally prefer the naked for quality-assurance purposes and cleanliness.
LMWDP #379
Carolina Espresso Services - "Quality Service for Espresso Equipment"

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JonR10

#40: Post by JonR10 »

BradyButler wrote:All that said, I personally prefer the naked for quality-assurance purposes and cleanliness.
+1

And, of course it's fun to watch the art of the naked pour :mrgreen:
Jon Rosenthal
Houston, Texas