What is the correct method for shot timing?

Beginner and pro baristas share tips and tricks for making espresso.
canyncarvr

#1: Post by canyncarvr »

From here:
HERE..
When a shot is timed, the timer starts (i.e. 0 time) when the pump button is pushed.
That's not from a 'gospel' thread..and not meant to be. It is what I've thought to be generally accepted shot timing and something I've read more than a few times.

But...browsing through links on the Resources page, I read from here:
For 1.5 ounces of espresso, the extraction should take between 23-30 seconds where the time starts when the espresso begins to flow from the spouts.
(emphasis is mine)


For the sake of argument, consider a perfect shot to be 27 seconds. I think there would be general agreement that in light of taking that as fact, a 19-22 shot would NOT be perfect..and neither would a 32-35 second shot.

The differences? The 5-8 seconds that is fairly common from 'pump on' to 'flow'.


I'm not trying to pick the proverbial nit, but the difference between the two points of view seems quite large to me, certainly large enough to make a good cuppa a bad one.


Which is it? IS there consensus on the issue?

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Bob_McBob

#2: Post by Bob_McBob »

A lot of people seem to go by when the pump is activated. It's further complicated by pump type, pre-infusion, and other factors. You are going to get a lot of replies telling you shot timing is only a basic guide, taste your shots, etc.
Chris

canyncarvr (original poster)

#3: Post by canyncarvr (original poster) »

Yes. I understand taste is the point of it all. I understand there are a good number of variables that figure into that result.

When tamp levels of +/-1mm, coffee doses measured in .1/g, temperatures of +/- a short handful of °s, and stepped grinders being unnacceptable due to the coarseness of their adjustment...THIS 'difference' seems quite a bit outside the 'ol box.

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cafeIKE
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#4: Post by cafeIKE »

Like all other variables, timing is set by the coffee and pull. It's only applicable to what you are pulling at the moment.

I switched coffees today : ½ turn finer, +0.5g, +1°F and +5s from last week.

Notice : NO mention of tamp :wink:

mitch236
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#5: Post by mitch236 »

I'll give you one idea where timing is very useful. For me, once I get a bean dialed in, I set my shot timer to the time I want the shot to run. That way, I don't need to really watch the shot pour and can steam milk instead while the shot is pulling. I start my timer the instant I turn the pump on.

canyncarvr (original poster)

#6: Post by canyncarvr (original poster) »

cafeIKE wrote:Like all other variables, timing is set by the coffee and pull. It's only applicable to what you are pulling at the moment.

I switched coffees today : ½ turn finer, +0.5g, +1°F and +5s from last week.

Notice : NO mention of tamp :wink:

Whew! I was getting worried there! If a tamp change was in the mix, I'm afraid I simply couldn't have handled it. :wink: ..indeed!

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another_jim
Team HB

#7: Post by another_jim »

Machines vary from 3 to 10 seconds dwell time (from pump turn on to first drop). Since half the people say go from the pump, and the other half say go from the first drop, I give my shot times based on half the dwell time plus all the flow time.

It may not be right, but it seems the most reasonable way of comparing long dwell with short dwell machines.
Jim Schulman

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BradyButler

#8: Post by BradyButler »

FWIW, the chronos pads on the Linea AV start timing when you push the button.

Initial contact between coffee and water seems like a relevant thing.

Most trainers that I know teach to start timing when you start the extraction.
LMWDP #379
Carolina Espresso Services - "Quality Service for Espresso Equipment"

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another_jim
Team HB

#9: Post by another_jim »

BradyButler wrote:Initial contact between coffee and water seems like a relevant thing.
True, but is it initial contact with the top of the puck, middle of the puck, or bottom of the puck? If the first drop appears, for instance, after seven seconds, then the initial contact between water and coffee is spread out over those seven seconds.
Jim Schulman

mitch236
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#10: Post by mitch236 »

Wouldn't you agree that timing is relative, assuming normal flow? IOW, I only use roaster's recommendations as a starting point. I find the timing that works for me and so long as I am consistent, that time should work shot after shot. If I tell you that I use 26 sec to brew 19.5gm of Vivace Vita, that time would only be relevant to me. Your time will be different based on many variables. Alternatively, if you set wanted to set up an experiment as another_jim did I think he has the best compromise for achieving repeatable results.