This thread is for discussion of VST baskets, not other brands, or models or my bengal cats.

When I got my Slayer I was told I needed a 20gram. I didn't like it compared to the Slayer basket. I always felt it needed more than 20grams, like 22. I recently sold it and got an 18gram. I put 19 in it and it works much better. But compared to the stock Slayer basket, it's messy even with WDT, or better yet it's UGLY in comparison. I am grinding finer and I do like the taste. I am willing to have the greater mess, less pretty shots for now in the 18. I also tried it in my Espresso Forge and liked it there. The 18 gram size is much more comparable to the Slayer basket. The VST has more holes extending the edge, and Slayer is slightly concave on the bottom.

I am curious what others think.

@pcrussell50 stated in a recent thread -

pcrussell50 wrote:VST baskets have more hole/open area than "traditional" baskets. So they flow faster. The VST use-case was/is so that you could grind finer to increase EY on machines without flow control, which would otherwise choke on grinds that fine. This was especially good for cafes where they not only don't have machines with flow control, but they don't have time to pull 60-90s shots with constant monitoring by the barista. BUT some of us in the hobby have machines with that kind of capability, and are willing to take the time to monitor the shots for the whole pull and make flow tweaks based on what we are seeing. Many of us in that category have shelved our VST's in favor of other high quality baskets with a slower (more traditional) flow rate. I have EPNWs and Breville's. For precision wonks, I have some microscope photos of the Breville compared to VST and Synesso baskets. This is from eight years ago mind. Synesso might have upped there game. The point was that the Breville baskets have very uniform and precise hole size and spacing. I do not have micro-photos of EPNW baskets however. While they won't break the bank, Breville baskets have gone up in price and there's also shipping. My EPNW14 was had for about a quarter or third the price of a new Breville basket after accounting for shipping.

Since moving to flow control, I can't remember the last time I used my VST for actual espresso.

I do keep it around nevertheless. And I actually use it when I make "single serve drip". For that I put a paper filter disc in the bottom of the VST, do a filter grind, put in 11-12g of coffee (18g VST). And then I set the needle valve on my machine to the drip rate that I want, and drip 190g or so into a 6oz teacup. There will be no pressure on the gauge as this is true drip, (not a choked puck), being made with an espresso machine capable of flowing at a slow drip flow.

-Peter

VST Website Description

Experience uniform extractions across all groups for the first time - permanently. The essential espresso filter for those in search of the ultimate cup.

Note on shipping: VST does not warrant delivery times. Please select the USPS or FedEX service that best suits your delivery time requirements.

Distributed World Wide

Features

VST's precision filters deliver consistent extraction performance over a wide range of concentration with reduced sediment
Designed to extract properly as a ristretto, normale or lungo with minimal or no change in grind setting at a fixed dose
Filters are matched for total square area to +/- 5% to ensure identical performance
(typical variances of standard filters range from 50-200% of nominal open square area)
All VST Filters are WARRANTED for ONE-YEAR and for ZERO DEFECTS
Holes are fabricated using a new micro-machine and finishing process
100% of holes are measured on every filter for min/max range limits on area and diameter to a precision of +/- 20 µm (individual QC report provided with every filter)
All holes are measured for circularity, placement, square area and blocked holes
Hole pattern is centered to +/- 1.0 mm and placement is oriented for uniform extraction throughout the entire puck
Wide outlet angle to prevent filters from clogging, patented anti-wear design ensures uniform performance for life of product
Improved structural integrity, will withstand deflection from pump cycling without premature fatigue failures (see VST Warranty)
Recommended tamper size:
25, 22, 20, 18, 15-g: 58.40 +0.00 -0.05mm diameter flat face

7-g: 40.7-40.9mm

I'm not sure what you're asking. It's long been known that the larger hole area of VST baskets requires a finer grind, which can help to fully extract light and light-medium roasts. We've also seen plenty of posts here saying that VST baskets require more careful prep and generally produce wetter pucks, though I've not seen any analysis of why that's the case.

All of these observations are consistent with my experience with VST baskets, which I've used almost exclusively since they were introduced.

I continued to use VST baskets after modifying my GS/3 AV to do flow and pressure profiling, including the ability to exactly imitate Slayer shots. Results have been great, except for certain light or light-medium South American beans from a certain roaster that I can't grind fine enough with my Monolith Flat with SSP burrs. In some cases I've been able to compensate by increasing RPM, and in other cases that hasn't worked because the exit path on the burrs gets gummed up and prevents further grinding (never seen this before with my grinder.)

I decided to try another basket in an attempt to solve the problem. I do singles almost exclusively, and all I had on hand were two ancient LM single baskets that I'm sure were made before VST baskets were introduced. Both baskets are poorly made and are not polished. On one, the hole pattern is *way* off center -- almost a joke. So I used the other one. Sure enough, I didn't have to grind as fine to get a good shot. Also, the LM baskets were much more forgiving of prep mistakes and the pucks came out much drier. I can see where a slower flow rate would be more forgiving, but I don't know why the pucks would be drier (maybe fewer fines retaining less water in the pucks?)

This was intriguing, so I looked around for a better 7g basket. Turns out there aren't as many choices for single baskets as there are for double baskets. I don't want to use the relatively new round-bottom single baskets because I have a Tidaka funnel and 41mm tampers that are designed for the classic 7g basket. I found just one high-quality 7g basket, made by IMS. When I got it, I was dismayed to find that the opening in the bottom had a considerably smaller diameter than a standard 7g basket, and my 41mm tampers wouldn't fit in it. I haven't measured the opening yet, but I think it must be on the order of 38mm or less. I suspect it would require a custom tamper base. It works with the Tidaka funnel, but if the dose is greater than 7g the puck will stick up above the edges of the depression in the bottom of the basket. I usually use an 8.5g dose because it works with the 7g VST basket without changing the grind setting from a VST 18g double basket. I tried that dose and was surprised that the shot didn't gush -- it ran like my typical Slayer shots -- and the extraction was quite even around the bottom of the basket. Nevertheless, I lowered the dose to 7g to keep the puck in the depression. So far, the results have been good at coarser grind settings.

The IMS basket, which is well-made, definitely has a much smaller hole area than the VST basket, mainly due to the narrow diameter of the depression. So it works more like the old LM baskets I have. It's pretty forgiving of prep. The pucks are drier than the VST pucks but wetter than the LM pucks, so the hole area may be in-between (I haven't done comparison measurements yet.)

Now, add this to the mix: soon I'll receive the new Shuriken LM burrs for my Monolith Flat. The concept behind these burrs is that they produce fewer fines. This lets you grind finer without choking the machine, possibly reducing or eliminating the need for long-slow preinfusion for light roasts, especially when using a basket with smaller hole area. One of the interesting questions this brings up is whether Slayer shots benefit more from grinding finer or the increased contact time during preinfusion -- i.e., is the more complete extraction due to more surface area of the grounds or longer contact time, or both?

My conclusion is that baskets are yet another tool in the bag. I'm sure I'll continue to use VST baskets for many beans, but some beans will require the IMS basket. The tools and techniques you use depend on the bean you're extracting.

I've also been having the most success with an 18g VST basket, though I do have to updose to 19g if I don't want a super soggy puck. Combining the basket with a slow ramping preinfusion for ~20s allows me to grind about half a turn finer on my Silenzio, and for juicier, fruitier coffees the taste difference from a more standard 6-8s preinfusion with my stock baskets is extreme.

Dick and everyone else, thanks. I wanted a thread people could find since the info was scattered. This is great. Although not the prettiest shots I am now enjoying my 18gram VST. Will. try it with 19 instead of 20 now.

Are you using the ridged or ridgeless vst

Ridgeless. Do you feel it matters?

Looking to buy some baskets for a new machine and wanted to see what people are liking

Thinking of getting the 18 and 20 ridged

Thnx

As far as I know the ridged and ridgeless are the same. Only matters if they don't stay in the portafilter very easy. I didn't like the 20. I felt for us you need to updose. I am having much more luck with the 18, using either 19 or 20 grams in the basket.