Tips with extraction needed.

Beginner and pro baristas share tips and tricks.
tnakir

Postby tnakir » Dec 30, 2018, 4:29 pm

Few days ago I roasted some Yirgacheffe (washed) to City+ and some Harrar (natural), same roast level, let it rest for 2-3 days and tried to make an espresso.

Grinder is Eureka Mignon Silencio, machine is Delonghi EC680 with depressurized filters.

With the Harrar, I managed to get good extraction, get a good taste (for this machine), 25s extraction, 9.5 grams of coffee to 20g of fluid (single basket).

I tried to tune in Yirga, but I spent a pound of coffee until I gave up. Either i'm getting gushers and extreme channeling, or I choke the machine. I tried up dose, down dose, finer grind - light tamp, coarser grind - hard tamp. No way I could get good in/out ratio. When I managed to get close to good extraction ratio i got tea-like coffee, extremely citrusy and salty with bright bright crema. When I try slowing down the extraction (30s in single basket) I get no crema and disgusting taste.

With some coffee I get really good extraction, good taste etc, with other I cant get anything near drinkable no matter what I do.

Is the machine so much limited it can't extract some coffee or is it me?

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slipchuck

Postby slipchuck » Dec 30, 2018, 5:29 pm

Try resting it for a few more days.
“There is nobody you can’t learn to like once you’ve heard their story.”

Bluenoser

Postby Bluenoser » Dec 31, 2018, 7:26 pm

tnakir wrote:Few days ago I roasted some Yirgacheffe (washed) to City+ and some Harrar (natural), same roast level, let it rest for 2-3 days and tried to make an espresso.

Is the machine so much limited it can't extract some coffee or is it me?


Just to be clear. Are you using the 'pressurized' baskets that came with the machine (single pin hole in the bottom); or did you obtain 'regular' baskets so that all your resistance is from the coffee puck as in most of the prosumer machines.

If you are using the 'pressurized' baskets (I realize you stated 'depressurized', but just want to make sure I understand), I never had any luck on those on my Delonghi Dedica (nearly identical to the 680). I found it gushed or choked and I was forever cleaning the screen and the mess created. Most espresso dark roasts worked okay in those baskets, but I had similar problems with some medium roasts.

Also the brew water temp in my Delonghi 685 machine varies in only 3 settings.. Low, med, high, but you have no idea what the actual brew water temp is. I found I had to use the 'high' setting on medium (City+?) roasts.

tnakir

Postby tnakir » Jan 02, 2019, 3:11 am

I depressurized the original baskets (cut off the bottom with single tiny hole so I ended up with "regular" basket).

I do get good extraction with some beans, but with lighter roasts I am not able to get good extraction no matter what I do.

I am thinking about moving to LaPavoni EP, I can get new Europiccola for very nice money.

Bluenoser

Postby Bluenoser » replying to tnakir » Jan 12, 2019, 4:59 pm

You have a great grinder, from what I read.. so that should not be the issue. I wonder if the brew water temp might not be optimum. The only way to know is to get a cut-off foam cup and quick & accurate thermometer, stick in the side and shove under the group and pull and see if your temp is in the 200f range. You likely have a low/med/high temp range and you might want to play around with those.

GeoSabo

Postby GeoSabo » Jan 13, 2019, 9:31 pm

Hi,

I think you are going through a lot of coffee trying to adjust a variable (grind) off another variable (weight).

You might want to dispense with weighing out the Yirga coffee and go for volume/dose amount instead.

Dose the filter basket up to the point where once tamped, the coffee lightly (very lightly) touches the dispersion screen of your group head. This way you will create a fixed point of reference (a fixed volume) from which you can adjust your grind to get the right flow rate (extraction) - but you have to keep the volume absolutely consistent. The usual telltale is whether you see, after extraction, a solid (wet but 'dry' if that makes sense) coffee cake in the filter basket and it comes out cleanly.

I have attached notes FYI

[img][img]/forums/userpix/35386_dosing_method_-_alternative.jpg[/img][/img]

tnakir

Postby tnakir » Jan 14, 2019, 3:09 am

Thnx for your input guys.

Regarding the temperature, yes, the machine has "Low", "Medium" and "High" settings, the machine was set to "Medium", I'll try the "High". What are temp values for that setting, I don't know, it isn't stated in the manual.

Regarding the amount of the coffee in the basket, I know how to dose the coffee, I don't go with N grams, I adjust considering some beans are more dense than others.

I personally believe the problem is with temperature, I don't think the machine can keep the water temperature high enough for this kind of beans (I spoke with a local roaster, he said Ethiopian beans often require 2-3 more degrees for proper extraction). I, under no circumstances couldn't proper extract lighter roasted coffee with this machine. Darker roast Brasils/Colombians were ok. So I went the "easy" way and ordered brand new La Pavoni EP (got a good price for a new unit, ~$450) :) I believe La Pavoni would be less picky with the beans type and roast level.