Rancilio Silvia v3- Maintaining Steam Pressure

Beginner and pro baristas share tips and tricks for making espresso.
LandonRoscoe
Posts: 12
Joined: 9 years ago

#1: Post by LandonRoscoe »

Hi All
I am looking for guidance on maintaining steam pressure for a 2nd and possibly 3rd pitcher. prior to heating up / turning on steamer switch, I cycle the boiler by running water through the wand until the light comes on. I wait for light to go off before turning the steam switch and it takes another 2 min to heat up before light is off and I can steam.

The tip is the standard 1 hole tip that comes with the machine. There is sufficient pressure for the 1st pitcher but if I try a second there is significantly less pressure available.

Because the Silvia is a single boiler and I sometimes make 2-3 milk based drinks at a time, I try to pull all shots then the milk. It can become a very lengthy process if I have to cycle the boiler after each pitcher.

Typically 8/9 ounces per pitcher.

Would a 4- hole tip steam faster and therefore leave more pressure in the machine?

Thank you!

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baldheadracing
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#2: Post by baldheadracing »

LandonRoscoe wrote:Would a 4- hole tip steam faster and therefore leave more pressure in the machine?
No. The Silvia's stock boiler thermostat setting and boiler size do not support a four-hole. Essentially, the overall amount of steam is fixed. A four-hole just kicks out that steam faster. There is also a two-hole available, but again, the amount of steam is fixed.

The Silvia is an "espresso and cappuccino maker." The machine was designed to make two single shots (one pull of the double basket), and combine those shots with one pitcher of one cup (250ml, 8 oz) of steamed milk split between the two shots, i.e., to make two 5 oz capps. That's it, that's all. If you want more, then you repeat the whole process. This is what the machine is designed to do.

You can try to do what you are doing, but - and I hate to say this - it is almost inevitable that you will eventually burn-out the boiler heating element. So many people (in North America) use the machine without understanding its limitations that Rancilio eventually re-designed the boiler in 2013 (IIRC) with a stronger (physically stronger, not more powerful) and replaceable heating element. (In older v1/v2/v3 machines, half of the boiler had to be replaced.) You can refill the boiler with some (some) water during/right after the first pitcher and get more steam that way, but you have to know how much water to add. Too much and you get no steam for a while, and too little and the boiler element eventually burns out. There are other tricks, for example, you can convert to a PID w/steam control for consistently higher steaming temps for more steam. (That's what I did.)

BTW, given that you are in Toronto - you MUST treat the water going into the machine, even if it is only with the little water softener thing that Rancilio sells for the input tube ($17 @ Greenbeanery at Bloor&Bathurst: http://greenbeanery.ca/products/rancili ... ner-p-6183). Otherwise scale will continue to form, and you'll soon have other problems.

Good luck. The machine is built like a tank and will last a very long time - mine is almost 10 years old - if you use the machine within its limitations ...
-"Good quality brings happiness as you use it" - Nobuho Miya, Kamasada

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LandonRoscoe (original poster)
Posts: 12
Joined: 9 years ago

#3: Post by LandonRoscoe (original poster) »

Hi
Thank you for the feedback. I guess I bought the machine for personal use and should expect it to do just that. Do you have any good suggestion /strategy for re-setting the machine?

Water- I have an RO system in my house.

Thanks!

spearfish25
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Joined: 9 years ago

#4: Post by spearfish25 »

A PID helps dramatically. As Bald said, you'll never be able to steam more than 8-10oz without risking your machine. The boiler is simply too small. To get more power, one trick is to start steaming when the boiler is near the temp point where the heater turns off. If you start just before this point, the heating element will stay on throughout your entire steaming. If you wait for the light to go off first, the element is off and you'll start dropping your steam pressure for a while before the element goes back on. The difference is pretty noticeable.

The steaming limitations and time restraints were my primary reason for upgrading to a double boiler machine.
______________
Alex
Home-Barista.com makes me want to buy expensive stuff.

LandonRoscoe (original poster)
Posts: 12
Joined: 9 years ago

#5: Post by LandonRoscoe (original poster) »

Hi

I would like to better understand how the machine works- ie how the boiler fills up, at what point does it refill, how does the water flow through the machine for the steam/hot water and for the group head. I think this would help me with understanding pressure, temperature, timing.....
I was following the below advice but am doing so without really understanding it.

It was suggested prior to pulling my shot to run water through the wand until the heating element turns on- this is all after my machine is warmed up and ready to go. It would ensure the pressure for steaming was at its highest. If I pull one shot then go straight to steam this makes sense. Do I need to go through this process if I pull a few shots and then steam or if I run water through the wand for an american, pull a couple of shots then want to steam a pitcher? I think if i understand how the machine works I could answer my own questions.

I have started making two smaller drinks instead of trying to pull multiple shots then trying to steam two separate pitchers. This has been working out better for me and have no issue with the smaller quantity- thanks for that suggestions.

Any comments/help would be appreciated.

Thanks
Steve

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baldheadracing
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#6: Post by baldheadracing »

The machine if fully manual. You control everything except the thermostat's behaviour. There is no auto-fill. You fill the boiler by turning the pump on. The pump stays on until you turn it off. Even if the boiler is full the pump will stay on as long as you keep the switch on, and will eventually pressurize the boiler to 15 or so bar. You know the boiler is full of (just) water because water comes out of the steam wand (and thus, the pressure in the boiler is 1 bar absolute). The steam wand outlet is at the top of the boiler.

The advice about running water has to do with controlling the steam thermostat. When you switch the heating element to the steam mode, and thus, the steam thermostat, the element comes on at one temperature (which I forget) and off at another temperature (which I also forget, but is higher). The temperature of the water is a proxy for the pressure of the steam in the boiler (assuming that there is room in the boiler for a decent amount of steam). Thus, by controlling a) the pump, i.e., water coming in, b) the steam wand (because you need some room in the boiler to generate steam, but too much is very bad because it will expose the heating element), and c) the steam switch, you can exceed the design parameters of the machine, and maximize the amount of steam that the boiler can produce while maximizing element life.
-"Good quality brings happiness as you use it" - Nobuho Miya, Kamasada