Making latte - milk first or espresso first? - Page 2

Beginner and pro baristas share tips and tricks.
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Benjammer

#11: Post by Benjammer » Apr 08, 2012, 10:19 pm

If you're trying to do latte art, then I'd brew the shot and steam the milk as quick as you can after that. Some people say leaving the espresso shot for 30sec and you ruined the espresso shot but I haven't noticed any detrimental effects.
Try it both ways for a few days if you haven't already, and let me know which way you prefer.

bgn

#12: Post by bgn » Apr 09, 2012, 12:53 am

Ive watched a lot of youtube video clips of people preparing lattes, but saw something in an Edmonton coffee shop that I'd never seen before. The barista prepared the espresso first, but before pouring the milk into the coffee she put about a tablespoon of the milk into the espresso and swirled it, mixing all of the crema with milk. Then she poured the rest of the milk. Ive been doing this for about a week now and really like it.

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haunce

#13: Post by haunce » Apr 09, 2012, 12:56 am

Always milk first..

kkillebrew

#14: Post by kkillebrew » Jun 13, 2012, 7:00 pm

I do this on my Pavoni Levers:

1. Clear the air from the boiler by opening the steam wand for a few seconds

2. Without the portafilter on lift the lever and shoot hot water in the espresso shot glass(es) thus heating and cleaning out the brew head, and getting the shot glass hot for the shot

3. Steam the milk until it is f165 to 170 degrees

4. Pour the hot water from the hot shot glass and wipe it out

5. Pull the shot

6. Pour the espresso shot into the cup

7. Pour the steamed milk into the espresso, rinsing the espresso shot glass with the milk to get all those succulent oils from the side of the shot glass into your drink

8. Perform a little latte art at the end of the milk pour if you are so inclined

9. Enjoy your drink

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allon

#15: Post by allon » Jun 13, 2012, 8:28 pm

kkillebrew wrote:
5. Pull the shot

6. Pour the espresso shot into the cup

7. Pour the steamed milk into the espresso, rinsing the espresso shot glass with the milk to get all those succulent oils from the side of the shot glass into your drink
Why not pull the shot directly into the latte cup so all the succulent oils are already there? Seems like a lot of unnecessary transfer, unless your desired cup doesn't fit under the group.
LMWDP #331

kkillebrew

#16: Post by kkillebrew » Jun 13, 2012, 10:07 pm

Why not pull the shot directly into the latte cup so all the succulent oils are already there? Seems like a lot of unnecessary transfer, unless your desired cup doesn't fit under the group.
Depends on the cup, most would fit, some taller ones would not. But the real reason is that I want the perfect pull which tends to be just under 2oz with the double porta filter basket and I know exactly where that point is with my espresso shot glass.

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HB
Admin

#17: Post by HB » Jun 13, 2012, 10:15 pm

I don't worry about volume too much, but if you want to adhere to a brew ratio, use a scale instead to measure the espresso's weight. That will eliminate variance due to crema volume and as an added bonus, you won't need to transfer from a shot glass.
Dan Kehn

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TheSunInsideYou

#18: Post by TheSunInsideYou » Jun 13, 2012, 10:15 pm

kkillebrew wrote:3. Steam the milk until it is f165 to 170 degrees
170! :shock: You're almost eliminating all the sweetness of the milk at that high of a temp. Do you want to make sure it stays hot longer, or do you just like it super hot?

-Dave-
Caffeine is proof that God loves us.

kkillebrew

#19: Post by kkillebrew » Jun 13, 2012, 11:33 pm

HB wrote:I don't worry about volume too much, but if you want to adhere to a brew ratio, use a scale instead to measure the espresso's weight. That will eliminate variance due to crema volume and as an added bonus, you won't need to transfer from a shot glass.
Those tips and guidelines do not really apply well to a lever machine, at least not to any Pavoni I've owned. Volume is critical because unlike a pump or automatic there is no setting to control how much water goes through the coffee. A single pull on the lever produces too little for a double shot so one must re-cock and push a bit more through to get it perfect, but not too much or it will be bitter. Depending on the grind, roast, and tamp, different volumes of espresso will be extracted on a particular pull. When you really look into it, levers are different beasts and different rules apply.

I concede your point regarding variance due to crema volume but I compensate for that by simply eyeing it... and I know my roasts and their characteristics pretty well. Anyway, weighing the coffee is an extra step that would be more difficult than using a shot glass (or require me to buy a different grinder). I do use the timer on my Vario to measure the volume of coffee and once set right for the roast it seems to produce very consistent results.

kkillebrew

#20: Post by kkillebrew » Jun 13, 2012, 11:39 pm

TheSunInsideYou wrote:170! :shock: You're almost eliminating all the sweetness of the milk at that high of a temp. Do you want to make sure it stays hot longer, or do you just like it super hot?

-Dave-
Dave - Super hot to me would be above 180, and I disagree that 170 eliminates most all the sweetness of the milk. I use a thermomoter when steaming and usually try to hit between 165 and 170. To my tastes the milk starts to turn at nearer 180 than 170. Now there may be a difference between whole milk and 2%, I'm not sure. I always use 2%. I find that milk at 160 is too cool for my liking unless I drink it immediately.