I know, this has been hashed out many times. But I'm getting nowhere. When you've investigated and implemented all the possible causes and solutions, then the only thing left is the impossible.

Quickmill Andreja, IMS precision shower screen, IMS precision basket
Ceado E37S


I'm happy with both. Recently I went to a bottomless portafilter. Now I can see all my flaws. First thing I did was go to a coarser grind. I now have an extraction that takes about 30 seconds. (I might adjust this more as I fix other problems.) I'm not overfilling the basket and the shower screen is not touching the top of the coffee. I'm using an Espro calibrated tamper and am trying to follow all of the (sometimes conflicting) advice on the web for leveling, etc.

Here is my problem. As I start extraction the coffee starts to come out at the 12 o'clock position on the filter. It slowly spreads to the rest of the basket, but there is spurting, sometimes major, at the 12 o'clock position. From the 2 o'clock to 10 o'clock side, I see deep chocolate coloring and the coffee looks great. The rest of it on the spurting side goes blond fast. This position *never* changes, regardless of how I tamp. As an experiment, I took out my shower screen and basket and turned them 180 degrees. Same results. My machine sits on a counter and is tilted a few degrees (only 3 or 4) towards the 12 o'clock position, but I don't think this causes my problem.

After removing my portafilter, the grounds on the 12 o'clock side are pretty dense, where the rest of the puck has some compression give. I would think this means the water is escaping around the puck on that side. But that is confusing because I wouldn't expect to have the dark color on the rest of the basket.

I'm looking for things I should be checking, doing differently, or other investigations to help me solve the problem.

Anyone have any suggestions?

Thanks,

Dave

Tamp with the handle pointing AWAY from you to rule out a tamping problem.
Try an extraction with a VERY light tamp- just enough to level the coffee. Like a smidgen more than the weight of the tamper.
Maybe invite another barista over.
Can we safely assume that the pressure gauge reports correct brew pressure.

Dave, I had a similar problem when I got my new machine and grinder (Ceado E37 S also). I was always getting most of the extraction out of one side of the portafilter. I tried everything, including spinning the basket inside the portafilter, to try to rule out any tamping issues. Nothing worked!

However, when I made two changes, the problem disappeared:

First, I stopped tamping altogether and went with just a distribution tool (the ASO Jack leveler in my case), and made sure I was using fresh locally roasted beans. I set the distribution tool to create almost no compression, just a leveling of the grounds.

Second, I replaced the stock (Profitec) basket with a VST basket.

I'll probably never know for sure, but I suspect that there was some very small "hardware" problem (either my machine wasn't as level as I thought or the water output was biased towards one side). Coupled with my less than perfect tamping, it produced a very unbalanced extraction. But that problem has gone away and hasn't returned, and I'm never going to tamp again!

YMMV of course, but don't give up.

Randy G. wrote:Tamp with the handle pointing AWAY from you to rule out a tamping problem.
Try an extraction with a VERY light tamp- just enough to level the coffee. Like a smidgen more than the weight of the tamper.
Maybe invite another barista over.
Can we safely assume that the pressure gauge reports correct brew pressure.

Hi Randy,

OK, I'll try those few things tomorrow.

I could invite another barista over, but "another" assumes there's already one here.

I have fiddled with brew pressure a little and it is now set at 9 bar during extraction.

I'll report back again.

Thanks,

Dave

d. wrote:I could invite another barista over, but "another" assumes there's already one here.

Walk into any Starbucks and behind the counter are "Baristas." The bar is set low right off.

I would shim the machine until it was level just to rule it out


Randy

Put the precision basket away and use the stock basket. See if the problem goes away or improves.

Randy G. wrote:Walk into any Starbucks and behind the counter are "Baristas." The bar is set low right off.

Starbucks doesn't have baristas. They have robots who use completely automated grinders, tampers, espresso machines, and air-assisted frothers. Not that Starbucks makes bad coffee. I do use them in a pinch when out of town.

My local coffee roaster makes terrific espresso. I've considered asking them who tunes their grinders/tampers/machines. I'm in there every 6 or 7 days for beans, but I keep forgetting.

Thanks,

Dave

slipchuck and Dave:

Thanks for the suggestions. I will try them as I can.

Randy G.: Turning the portafilter handle before pressing didn't help. I did see some minor spurts on the 6 o'clock side though.

Thanks,

Dave

Have you tried rotating the portafilter while grinding? With my super jolly, I have to bias the portafilter so the grinds hit the 6 o'clock position of the basket and then after grinding I level the grinds. If I don't do this even though I end up leveling the grounds after, I get channeling on the 6 o'clock side of the puck. Try rotating during the grind to see if that helps.