Good question. There really isn't any way of telling. (Until tech guru taps into the control logic) But I assume the temp was pretty stable the whole time simply because 6oz in 90s is about the same as 2oz in 30s, which is right up there in espresso territory.

-Peter

I did a quick test this morning with my normal double basket, brew-grind, 18g ish. Didn't measure the output, just pushed/held the manual button for preinfusion until it timed out at 90 seconds. Coffee tasted really good. I'd say it was richer than when I brew in the Bonavita. Definitely worth playing with some more, dialing it in a bit. Looks to be a great way to brew a cup at a time.

Thanks for sharing this tip, Peter!

I use the lowest pump setting but to tell the truth I haven't noticed a difference between 55 and 60%. I use a filter grind and an aeropress filter in the bottom of the basket. Consistently delish at 10g:160g when the pour is around 40-60s.

Ah, thanks for the aeropress filter reminder: I have a bunch of those somewhere from when I experimented with them in the pf for espresso (epic fail). Yea, I think my preinfusion is set to default, as I never otherwise use it. I may have to program one of the auto buttons for a max duration preinfusion, if that is even possible. I only use the auto buttons for quick flushes & back flushes to save button life on the manual one.

instantkamera wrote:Unless you add water, that's not really the same thing. Maybe close to an aeropress...

Well, it wasn't the same thing as drip if espresso machine used either, because there was some pressure as well. Are we sure that something like 1:14 ratio is ideal under higher pressure?
However, in my case, ratio was just a consequence of amount of beans left in the bag ... and it's not a good idea to drink aeropress right after espresso anyway, always tasting boring in comparison (to me at least)

vit wrote: Well, it wasn't the same thing as drip if espresso machine used either, because there was some pressure as well. Are we sure that something like 1:14 ratio is ideal under higher pressure?

Im of the belief that pressure is largely just a means of expediting water passage through grounds, allowing a finer grind that would otherwise extend water contact too long due to clogging in a gravity fed system. That is literally the case with the aeropress, where grind can be quite fine and the plunger used to remove the brew water before it over extracts. The amount of pressure seems inconsequential, provided the contact time and grind size are properly set to compliment each other.

Now there's obviously a difference when it comes to high pressure espresso extraction, at least in terms of *appearance* (crema and all that), but it's still not clear to me how pressure is contributing to the non-visual aspects of extraction. I know that you can have properly extracted espresso at 5-6 bar that is largely indistinguishable from a 9 bar shot (on a refractometer, say), so suffice to say, I tend to put less stock in pressure as an absolute.

I have yet to read a true study of pressure's effect on extraction, so if anyone has anything academic, I'd be happy to have something to read on the matter.

Variables like pressure, flow, grind atc are interconnected and changing pressure affects the flow, changing the grind affects speed of water through the passages in the puck, so it's hard to tell how much pressure directly affects extraction. Of course, there is more crema if the pressure is higher and water dissolves more CO2

But whatever the case, I doubt anyone got a good coffee at 9 bar ( or even only 4-5) with 1:14 ratio ... unless it was added after extraction ...

Not to be a buzzkill, but isn't this discussion about discovering a https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caffè_crema

Nothing buzzkill about it. I consider it good news for those of us who have the equipment that can make it. I travel to Europe a lot and the first thing I do in Amsterdam, is get one.

The ones I've been making are more like a drip or pour over in terms of time exposure of grounds to water.

-Peter

robertmw wrote:Not to be a buzzkill, but isn't this discussion about discovering a https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caffè_crema

Thanks for the info, it's useful for those that didn't know what to call an extreme lungo, me included. At least now I can search for more caffe crema recipes!