Help dial-in grind & extraction - Page 3

Beginner and pro baristas share tips and tricks for making espresso.
cartnj
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Joined: 8 years ago

#21: Post by cartnj »

HoyaZot wrote:Ok. Blue bottle sent me their Hayes Valley Espresso blend. Roasted 9/11/16. I will let them sit a couple more days and then give them a whirl.

Also got a scale. Looks like I'm going to have to adjust for the Oracle's overdose though.
I have been using the Blue bottle 17Ft Ceiling in my Oracle at 25 grind setting and 30 second and so far it has been really good. I also got the Hayes valley espresso blend I will try that this weekend. My Oracle is about 6 months old but I have been getting inconsistent shots and the frothing is "ok"... I do miss the manual frothing on my last few machines. The manual frothing on the Oracle is not very good

cartnj
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Joined: 8 years ago

#22: Post by cartnj »

canuckcoffeeguy wrote:In the meantime, did you try grinding finer with your other beans to slow the flow rate, and stop the shot sooner? As we suggested?
Not sure about others experience, but On my Oracle and depending on the bean, my machine will actually flow faster on Finer settings.

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canuckcoffeeguy
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#23: Post by canuckcoffeeguy replying to cartnj »

This would indicate either a grinder issue and/or channeling in the puck. All other variables being equal, grinding finer inherently reduces flow rate. Unless you get fractures and channeling. And unless your grinder is not actually grinding finer, despite setting it to grind finer.

cartnj
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Joined: 8 years ago

#24: Post by cartnj replying to canuckcoffeeguy »

Just checked again and I went from grind setting 25 to setting 23 and flow started at 12 seconds as opposed to 14 with the 25 setting. Shot tasted slightly better as well.

I don't see any channeling in the puck but wouldn't the flow start later if going finer?

Do you have this same machine?

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AssafL
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#25: Post by AssafL »

Since (as a superautomatic) the machine grinds and tamps but then you remove the portafilter I'd measure the weight as well as do WDT. Most of the times, if grinding finer doesn't work it is a distribution issue and WDT will solve that.

Otherwise it looks very dark and perhaps old (albeit the crema is a wee bit too thin to see stratification).

Do they sell the coffee in roast date marked bags (3rd wave) or is it from a hopper? Sometimes roasters dump new roasts on top of the older roasts still in the hopper....
Scraping away (slowly) at the tyranny of biases and dogma.

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CorvusDoug
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#26: Post by CorvusDoug »

Once you get a scale it will be a little easier to understand what's going on. Think of your espresso recipe as a multiple of the dose. So, starting with 20 grams and getting a yield of 30 grams would be a multiple of 1.5 (20g in and 40g out would be 2x, etc). Aim for a time around 28 seconds, give or take.

Generally speaking:
-A lower multiple (less than 2x) will be stronger but more tart.
-A higher multiple (north of 2x) will be lighter bodied but sweeter. *but approaching 3x will get watery and bitter!

If you're using a fresher more modern roast (like some Blue Bottle) I would recommend starting with a multiple around 2x. Hope that helps...good luck!
Corvus Coffee Roasters - Denver, CO

HoyaZot (original poster)
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#27: Post by HoyaZot (original poster) »

I burned through my locally roasted beans. Cleaned out the hopper, brushed the upper burr, ran the grinder to get the rest out, and refilled the hopper full up with blue bottle hayes valley. see below.

by the way, thanks guys for all the replies and help. i am really excited to get this machine dialed in -- as best as possible, anyway -- and appreciate the feedback.

HoyaZot (original poster)
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#28: Post by HoyaZot (original poster) »

OK, I got impatient. I pulled one double-shot with the new Blue Bottle beans. Here are the results; I'm going to hold off on everything until I get some feedback from you guys. Thanks again for all the help! :mrgreen:
  • Blue Bottle Hayes Valley - Roasted Sept. 11 and rested since Sept. 13
  • Blue Bottle sent a card recommending: Dose - 20g, boiler 201.5F, extraction 32s, yield 20-20.5g
first extraction results:
  • Dose (automatic) 23g
  • Extraction time 32s total, including 7 seconds pre-infusion at 60% pressure
  • Yield - 46.5g (I stopped the extraction sooner than blue bottle suggested because this yielded close to 60mls)

Finer grind?

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aecletec
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#29: Post by aecletec »

Can you further describe the taste? More information would help direct changes in the recipe :)

RyanJE
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#30: Post by RyanJE »

Not trying to pry, but have you ever thought of buying a stand alone grinder? You need to be able to control the dose, and distribution, tamp.

IMO 23g is a huge shot to begin with. Also, do you have a bottomless? Or just spouted. You have to understand if you are getting an even pull.

Post a video of your routine and or shot
I drink two shots before I drink two shots, then I drink two more....