Help: Bottomless Portafilter Spitting All Over Creation - Page 2

Beginner and pro baristas share tips and tricks for making espresso.
rbh1515
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#11: Post by rbh1515 »

Maybe better grinder?

SEMIJim (original poster)
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#12: Post by SEMIJim (original poster) replying to rbh1515 »

Better than a nearly $500 Baratza Vario? :shock:

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baldheadracing
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#13: Post by baldheadracing »

slaughter wrote:Have similar machine - Barista Express. My attempts with naked portafilter taught me that the machine is not capable for that kind of extraction. ...
I have had no issues using my friend's very old BES870, although I find that the stock Breville (unpressurized) double basket is limited to 12g-14g, depending on coffee. I will say that the single basket is a horror show, and it takes some effort to get the group up to a decent temperature.
rbh1515 wrote:Maybe better grinder?
A stock (un-Alicorned) Vario with ceramic burrs is 100% fine for the coffee that he is pulling. The flapper holding coffee back is a bit annoying and needs a purge first thing in the morning (or the flapper flipped), but that's no different from most other grinders that are designed to work with a full hopper like the Vario.

Yeesh. I know that home-barista is the land of upgrade-itis, and I'm as guilty as anyone :oops:, but equipment is not the issue here.

SEMIJim - the next time you go to Costco and buy that huge bag of Lavazza:
- set aside a bunch of small glass jars with good lids, like canning jars (I use 4oz ones).
- when you open the bag, immediately put all of the coffee beans into the jars. All. That bag was Nitrogen flushed and is useless for preserving the coffee once opened.
- put the sealed jars in the freezer, or at least the fridge.
- add coffee as needed to the Vario's hopper to keep it the beans level at about 1/2way up the hopper.
With the hopper at a constant level, you should be able to adjust the Vario's timer to give you 14g of coffee +/- 0.5g pretty consistently.
-"Good quality brings happiness as you use it" - Nobuho Miya, Kamasada

randytsuch
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#14: Post by randytsuch »

FWIW, I went from a vario to a nice Kinu Phoenix hand grinder, and think the hand grinder does a better job.
I never aligned my vario though, its on my list of things to do.

When I used my vario for espresso, I noticed if you switched between coarser grinding and espresso it didn't do as good of a job as leaving it set for just espresso.

Randy

Nate42
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#15: Post by Nate42 »

SEMIJim wrote:Better than a nearly $500 Baratza Vario? :shock:
Unfortunately around here a Vario is considered maybe 1 notch above "low end". Don't let us snobs get to you though, if it's in good working order a Vario is more than capable of good bottomless shots. It may not be the ideal grinder for pushing the boundaries of extraction on ultra light roasts or whatever, but it will make very good traditional espresso. The grinder isn't your problem unless something is wrong with it. My money is still on the coffee, and the grind. Stale Italian coffee needs to be ground quite a bit finer than fresher coffee.

SEMIJim (original poster)
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#16: Post by SEMIJim (original poster) »

Thanks again for all the hints, all.

I think I'm going call this one a bad investment in time & money and send this bottomless PF back. I'm having absolutely zero success in reducing the spitting no matter what I do. (Incl. manual pre-infusion.)

One thing I've noticed is the spitting is fairly consistent in its pattern--particularly the worst, which is one large spot to the left. Now ISTM unlikely that I'm making the exact same mistake in puck prep every single time--regardless of grind, quantity, or tamping pressure. My conclusion is some, or maybe even much, of what I'm experiencing may be a fault with the PF basket.

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baldheadracing
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#17: Post by baldheadracing »

I'd use the stock Breville basket, not the one that came with the portafilter.

Keep in mind that the bottomless portafilter in and of itself can't cause spritzing. Using a portafilter with spouts just hides the problem. The only possible reasons are:
1. Stale coffee.
2. Your technique.
3. Broken equipment.

Good luck!
-"Good quality brings happiness as you use it" - Nobuho Miya, Kamasada

SEMIJim (original poster)
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#18: Post by SEMIJim (original poster) »

baldheadracing wrote:I'd use the stock Breville basket, not the one that came with the portafilter.
The stock basket that came with the machine is a pressurized basket. I bought an after-market non-pressurized PF basket, because Breville is out of stock on theirs with absolutely no clue when they'll again have them in stock--if ever.

Maybe I'll give it one more go, with the other basket I have.
baldheadracing wrote: Keep in mind that the bottomless portafilter in and of itself can't cause spritzing.
Yes, but the basket?
baldheadracing wrote: Using a portafilter with spouts just hides the problem.
I realize. But I'm making zero progress. Meanwhile I'm able to pull satisfactory shots with the stock PF with spouts. I was hoping to improve, but all I'm accomplishing is to spray coffee all over creation and get a bad attitude about the whole thing.

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baldheadracing
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#19: Post by baldheadracing »

Oops, I meant the Breville un-pressurized basket.

I have little faith in any basket unless it is from a known-good manufacturer or supplier. Baskets are easy to make; good baskets are not.

As an aside: there's a reason that Breville didn't include a non-pressurized basket with the Bambino. Non-pressurized baskets give superior results, but are much harder to use. A common phrase here is, "Do you want coffee or a hobby?" My friends who just want to make lattes with their Breville thermoblock machines all use pressurized baskets.
-"Good quality brings happiness as you use it" - Nobuho Miya, Kamasada

SandraF
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#20: Post by SandraF »

As others have mentioned, the bottomless portafilter is not the CAUSE of spritzing, etc. The bottomless portafilter simply REVEALS flaws in either grind or puck preparation.

I'd keep the bottomless portafilter and work on other aspects. That way when you upgrade your grinder you will be able to see how the shot of espresso improves.

I realize that $500 sounds like a lot for a grinder, but in making espresso especially, that amount unfortunately does not get one into the higher echelon of performance grinders.
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