Having trouble steaming milk with my Breville

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mikedafter
Posts: 11
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#1: Post by mikedafter »

Hello! Looking for some help with adding texture into my milk. I'm currently using the Breville BES840XL/A the Infuser and I get almost exclusively hot, thin milk.

I've been watching howto videos on youtube and have tried quite a few different things. I know this might be hard without a video but I'll try to explain what my texturing routine is. I don't use much milk, about 1/3 of the frother's worth. The milk I'm using is whatever they sell at trader joes? (red flags??) Wand placement has been a big emphasis, I try to position the wand towards the top of the milk, not too shallow that it spouts milk everywhere and not too deep. (maybe placing the wand a centimeter within the milk positioned to one side). I do generally hear air going into the milk. I tilt the milk very slightly as air enters. Using my hand I feel for the temperature of the milk stopping the texturing as the frother gets just hot enough to touch. And what i almost always get is thin, heated, untextured milk.

A few times i guess I lucked into some textured milk though I've been unable to recreate those conditions.

This is my cry for help. I'm sick of drinking hot milk and espresso. No can live under these conditions. Please...?

(If a video is necessary I'll try to follow up)

Nunas
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#2: Post by Nunas »

I had a bunch of Breville machines that produce steam using the same components as those in your machine. That is, the vibe pump pulses water through the thermoblock/thermocoil to produce steam. These machines are noted for having very low steam output and invariably they have one tiny hole in the wand to compensate for the lack of output. Assuming it isn't a problem with the milk (which does happen), then it just amounts to a lot of experimentation and practice to get it right.

I strongly urge you to get a milk thermometer with a good sized face, such as the Rattleware. Try to develop your desired amount of foam early in the process, even if this means producing some bigger bubbles. Once the milk has reached about 20-degrees C, you need to have the milk expanded to the target level. At this point, don't 'plunge' the tip, as is often recommended. Just raise the jug a bit so that you are no longer entraining air. By keeping the tip fairly high, you should be able to break down the bigger bubbles. This is critical in your machine, as it lacks the power of a boiler machine to properly mix the milk and break up the bubbles if placed too low. Stop at 60-degrees. Over heating will result in cooked foam that will quickly break down (and it tastes funny).

Know what you're shooting for in terms of the type of foam. Over-expansion of the milk is your enemy here. For microfoam (for latte art and flat whites) you want to 'pull' the milk to much less than double its bulk. For cappuccino foam you can go to about double, as you want some drier, floaty foam for the cap. If you pull too far, the foam will break down.

Don't try to texture too much or too little milk. This means having the appropriate sized foaming jug and filling it to the bottom of the spout (more or less). Too little milk will overheat before you get it expanded and your machine simply can't handle the large volumes that a boiler machine can. Your limitation is about enough foam for two standard double caps or lattes.

The type of milk does not matter, anything from 1% to well over 4% will foam. I've never tried skim, but I bet it foams fine. Half-and-half is hard to foam, but it can be done. Full cream is really hard to do. You will sometimes run into a jug of milk, of a previously good brand, that simply won't foam (I had one just the other day). Also, there are some brands that foam better than others (when we lived in NZ there was one brand that the cafes simply would not use for this reason). The temperature of the milk isn't very important in a boiler machine; I often leave milk on the counter to nearly room temperature. But, with a boiler machine I can pull the milk to the desired volume within five or ten seconds, without passing much beyond 20-degrees C. You can't to that with a thermoblock steamer; so you need to start with cold milk.

Most of the descriptions and videos of how to do this are done on boiler machines, which can get to the desired texture in just tens of seconds. You're going to have to experiment until you get it right, as most thermoblock steamers need a good minute to get to the same point.

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Chris65
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Joined: 6 years ago

#3: Post by Chris65 »

A video might be helpful. Are you purging the steam wand before you start? I know my bes870xl took a minute to get the steam started and it put out a lot of water before the steam. That could be an issue.

Another issue might be having too little milk. Typically you want to have it just below the start of spout. Maybe try with a little more milk in the pitcher

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slipchuck
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#4: Post by slipchuck »

I find it harder to get good microfoam with 1/3. try putting enough milk that it comes to where the start of the pouring spout is

Good luck

Randy
“There is nobody you can’t learn to like once you’ve heard their story.”

DaveB
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#5: Post by DaveB »

Chris65 wrote:Another issue might be having too little milk. Typically you want to have it just below the start of spout. Maybe try with a little more milk in the pitcher
While it is easier to steam that amount, that's like 8 ounces of milk! Even a 12 ounce latte cup only needs 6 oz. For my 10.5 oz latte cups, I use about 5 oz, which sits well below that line. I'm consistently getting great results, even with the boiler cranked up to the max (185°). For my 6 oz caps, I steam about 3 oz milk in a little 7 oz stainless syrup pitcher, which fills it halfway. I only open the steam valve about halfway, which keeps things under control and produces great microfoam.
Von meinem iPhone gesendet

Chris65
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#6: Post by Chris65 replying to DaveB »

While I agree that you don't always need that much milk. I found with the weaker steam power on the barista express I could get the roll easier with more milk. With less milk it just wasn't making a vortex. Not sure why but just my experience.

I now have a breville dual boiler and I can steam less milk no problem.

forbiddenbeat
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#7: Post by forbiddenbeat »

Just as an experiment, what happens if you try to introduce too much air (e.g. put the wand very high, get some spitting and large bubbles). Can you successfully get really foamy milk, like a traditional cappuccino?

FWIW I had trouble at first getting good microfoam on by BDB since the steam pressure is so low compared to more robust machines, but eventually figured out I just needed to aerate the milk for a lot longer than I expected.

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spromance
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#8: Post by spromance »

mikedafter wrote:I try to position the wand towards the top of the milk, not too shallow that it spouts milk everywhere and not too deep. (maybe placing the wand a centimeter within the milk positioned to one side).
Two thoughts from another Infuser owner: First, everyone above is right in alluding to the big difference between our machines, and commercial / prosumer machines - there's not enough steam power to 'push' the milk enough and (therefore) introduce air when the Infuser's tip is submerged that deep. How deep? Yes, I mean even 1cm deep. I know all the YouTube vids talk about that depth, but they're all typically working with much greater steam power.

For my Infuser, I'm literally just skimming the surface of the milk to begin introducing air (you'll get that paper-tearing or kissing sound...not the screaming sound, that means it's still too deep). The worst that happens if you aren't 'deep enough' is that the milk begins to spatter, which can be solved by veeeery slightly raising the pitcher. Assuming the right depth, once I've introduced enough air, I raise the pitcher (lowering the tip) slightly, but honestly not too much because as long as the tearing sound has stopped, you still need to be pretty close to the surface to keep the vortex swirling and mixing your textured milk into the rest.
Chris65 wrote:Another issue might be having too little milk. Typically you want to have it just below the start of spout. Maybe try with a little more milk in the pitcher
Mike, I can now steam 'under capacity' after 2 years with mine, but if you're having trouble, I would agree with Chris and others above and first focus on using a volume of milk that, yes, might be wasteful, but will be much easier to learn the ropes with. Does anyone in your house like steamers? You could just put a bit of sugar, or maple syrup, or vanilla syrup in a glass to mix with your steamed milk leftovers and make them very happy ;) That was kind of my wife's gateway drug over to lattes.

Back to the volume of milk, I'm not at home to take pics now, but I find that with milk up to the bottom of the 'V' of the spout, I can best get the whirlpool/vortex motion with the steam wand quite angled, while keeping the bottom of the pitcher parallel to the counter. If using less milk than that, I find it helps to have the wand more perpendicular to the counter (but not straight down of course) and tilt the pitcher back a bit with my wrist to get the milk swirling.

Sorry that's not as helpful as a pic or vids, but I wish you the best in your pursuit! Silky microfoam definitely is possible with the Infuser.