Quest M3 Mods - Page 21

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.
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TomC (original poster)
Team HB

#201: Post by TomC (original poster) »

happycat wrote:Absolutely. I still haven't captured the change since drilling holes but I think your description makes sense. I think I used to coast more and got used to the general inertia. Now using higher fan... I will bend my slats before the next roast and see how it goes. Thanks for the continued sharing.

While it remains to be proven, I'm starting to think that I can also modify (slightly) how I begin the roasting process. Since the roaster is now obviously more capable in terms of convective heat transfer, I don't have to rely on conductive drying as much in the first phase. What I aim to accomplish is simply running the drying phase with just a tad less heat on the element, and just the slightest trickle of the fan. My personal opinion is that this might lead to better effects in regards to maillard reactions and the surface of the bean at the end of the roast. Theoretically, it might allow for better developed coffee at a lower finish temperature and surface color. But that remains to be seen.

I think the significant portion of conductive heat transfer with such a thin drum on these little roasters is not the most ideal setting.

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Beanz

#202: Post by Beanz »

The Quest M3 I have was built in 2011 and has the Trier on the left hand side. Facing the front of the roaster the drum turns in a clockwise direction.
The M3s drum in previous posts is not suitable for my 2011 Quest. The baffles in the drum for moving the beans are mounted on different angles.
I have been communicating with Quest and they are manufacturing a drum for me to suit the earlier models
The model number is M3d
I hope this is of assistance to anyone considering this modification
M3s

2011 drum

pcivic

#203: Post by pcivic »

Hy all,

I am really having hard time to choose my home roaster and this topic makes me even more confused :shock:

So I am in the market for new quest m3s or huky 500, but I am convincing my self to get quest because, it is more complete solution, does not require gas, has already its own heat suply, ventilation regulation, you can charge and drop beans without removing parts of roaster (pipe at huky) etc...

BUT!

This topic makes me a bit skeptic with all those mods?
Were you unhappy with stock performance of your quest roasters?
Do these mods really make a lot of difference? Are they "must?

Probably the new m3s version has a lot of this problems solved?

How are you handling batch size after a year or two after purchase? Is it still sufficient
And is without any mods possible to roast 250g batches with good roast quality?

Or should I just go for Huky 500?

Thanks a lot!

happycat

#204: Post by happycat » replying to pcivic »

Stock quest is fine.

This forum is chock full of maker types, people who enjoy tinkering, modding, automating, etc. It's an attitude of continuous improvement.

Your choice of roaster should relate to capacity, energy source, cost, repairability, and availability of a support community. To me, evidence of modifications is a huge plus... Ways to customize the product to better suit individual needs. That is the maker way. It's also why I bought a Gaggia Classic years ago and have modified it.

At first blush, options like mods are overwhelming. As you progress, these options become a source of pathways to personalization to get more of what you want and less of what you don't.

The awesome thing is Tom's mod got incorporated into a product option from the factory. Amazing! That's the strength of having a community around a product.
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AssafL

#205: Post by AssafL »

Never thought modders would scare non modders away.

As a general rule: modders gravitate towards higher quality devices that are well built and also where there is a community. All the hard work one puts into mods means you'd want the modded device to work for a long time.

Modding is not "fixing a bad product". Communities tend to shun bad products, not invest endless hours modding them.

Modding: All products have compromises (engineering is the practice of finding suitable compromises). Modding is about tuning: playing with these compromises. Want a lighter roast that is well developed - add air. Etc.

Progressive optimization is another type of mod. The GS3 came out when flow profiling was not yet ready. So when Slayer came out - some of us modded the GS3 for a flow profile. We did not fix a bad GS3 - just created an opportunity to see what the Slayer and flow profiling was about. For many of us it remained optional on the GS3. Beats buying another machine!!! (And surprisingly cheaper).
Scraping away (slowly) at the tyranny of biases and dogma.

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AssafL

#206: Post by AssafL »

As for 250grams - the maximum I roast and get ample control headroom is 225gr. Control is less predictable at 270gr (never tried 250).

In stock configuration (2011 model - not a current model) the most I'd roast was 150gr for predictable control.
Scraping away (slowly) at the tyranny of biases and dogma.

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FotonDrv

#207: Post by FotonDrv »

The new perforated M3s drum arrived Saturday, record time for transit from that part of the world.

The drum has the vanes oriented properly and just dropped right into place with need to modify anything. I guess that Molly got the photos of the faceplate and the drum and they made the drum with the vanes in the proper orientation.

I blackened the drum before putting it in.

I removed the slats on the fan exit/exhaust and now the flow of air through the roaster is MUCH STRONGER!

While I was at it I added a second layer of insulation to the drum shell, so now it has Durablanket AND Aerocel.

Will try a roast this afternoon.

Old Drum, .071" thick.


New Drum, .061" thick, holes in back plate measure .118" in diameter.






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Beanz

#208: Post by Beanz »

Stephen I am interested in what materials you have used to insulate your Quest. It appears you have a layer of aluminium backed fibre material under the black insulating material. I am interested in both materials but especially the black insulation that tolerates the temperature. I have struggled to find a suitable material available in small Qty's locally

The new drum looks good, mine must be due any day. I look forward to reading your feedback on performance, changes to roasting procedure and more importantly what you see as changes in the cup.

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FotonDrv

#209: Post by FotonDrv » replying to Beanz »

Beanz, I used Durablanket held in place with foil tape and the Aerocel held in place with Stainless steel zip ties.

I would attach the PDF files but I cannot figure out how to do it. email me and I will send the pdf 's
That Light at the End of the Tunnel is actually a train

happycat

#210: Post by happycat »

TomC wrote:While it remains to be proven, I'm starting to think that I can also modify (slightly) how I begin the roasting process. Since the roaster is now obviously more capable in terms of convective heat transfer, I don't have to rely on conductive drying as much in the first phase. What I aim to accomplish is simply running the drying phase with just a tad less heat on the element, and just the slightest trickle of the fan. My personal opinion is that this might lead to better effects in regards to maillard reactions and the surface of the bean at the end of the roast. Theoretically, it might allow for better developed coffee at a lower finish temperature and surface color. But that remains to be seen.

I think the significant portion of conductive heat transfer with such a thin drum on these little roasters is not the most ideal setting.
This sounds interesting-- pretty much the opposite of what I've been up to.

I did make a mod similar to yours on the exhaust vents-- rather than cut them, I twisted them with pliers to flatten them all out. I can feel higher air flow.

I have been aggressive with heat based on a few heuristics (and have recently bumped air up to 5-6 since putting holes in the drum and opening the vent):

1. To have system energy for a declining ROR, charge hot (400F+)
2. To lengthen drying time (and change the curve shape) especially to tame naturals, cut power after charge and add power back after turning point
3. When ROR peaks after drying, start edging power off to prevent a ROR straightline bake
4. Approaching first crack back off power to prevent spike in ROR
5. Then reintroduce power to avoid a dip in ROR
6. Ride out ROR curve in downward slope adjusting power
7. When ROR has no room left in downward slope, drop

It always tastes sweet with a balance of acidity and no grass even if dropped as low as 381F. I do use the variety of drop temps in a series of batches to create roast blends which has been quite nice. This seems largely a factor of how far I let the ROR peak after drying before edging off power. That way I can get drop temps ranging say 390-415 then mix a light and a dark.

However, this is clearly not a great approach in terms of setting and meeting a drop temperature target. And florals and strong fruits are just teases now and then.

How does this relate to mods? Well, it relates to your point about agility of the roaster and how mods to the drum and vent allow for easier changes during the roast. Before I felt I had to build up a huge heat bank to coast me through a declining ROR, then I had to do that even more if I wanted to extend drying by cutting power from drop to turning point.

I guess I could use some improved heuristics as they relate to the mods. Particularly as I'd like to move to a TC4 setup this fall.
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