North Coffee TJ-067 / JYR-1DA Roaster Early Discovery Notes - Page 2

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.
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beanflying

#11: Post by beanflying »

hungrybird wrote: Also beanflying will you please send me bank account number or paypal email they use to accept payment ? I just want to cross check before dealing with merchant without using escrow.

Thanks
I brought mine from Australia from another source sorry I can't help you with Northcoffee.
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saoye

#12: Post by saoye » replying to beanflying »

I bought mine from north coffee and I just received the Bill of Lading/paperworks today. I can vouch for their communication being top notch but until I have the roaster in my possession and I am happily roasting that is as far as I will go in terms of recommendations for now.

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boar_d_laze

#13: Post by boar_d_laze »

Coleman Kao, the same guy who reps the 1kg North Gas roaster on US ebay, reps the 1kg electric in the US as well. I'm not sure whether it would be more or expensive to go through him than through the factory... but a helluva lot easier, that's for sure. Coleman is a good businessman and a good guy. Prices may or may not be negotiable.

The Norths are large units, shipped in large crates. Expect big freight.

BDL
Drop a nickel in the pot Joe. Takin' it slow. Waiter, waiter, percolator

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saoye

#14: Post by saoye »

For the USA and Canada I'd go through Coleman for sure and there is not much difference in price as Coleman purchases in bulk for larger discounts, however my understanding is that he only sells and reps the gas version of the 1kg from north coffee. Coleman sells the Amazon 1kg electric roaster with the analogue gauge. I initially was looking at him for the electric but realised it was 2 different roasters. Careful that you don't confuse the two. look at the weight differences.

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beanflying

#15: Post by beanflying »

Quite surprised that there is an assumption that North Coffee actually manufactures anything? What they badge as TJ ... has been around a lot longer known as JYR-1D amongst others names and predates the North Coffee websites existence as far as I am aware. So to call it a North Roaster doesn't make any sense. A quick search of Alibaba will find you a dozen Chinese companies trying to sell you the same roaster.

"Domain Name: NORTHCOFFEE.NET Created on: 28-Dec-11"

Not saying don't buy from them but be aware they are most likely NOT the manufacturer of this roaster and is standard Chinese Trading company behavior to appear as something different to overseas customers.

Off to my cave to roast some Siphon beans for next week :)
Levers RULE :-)

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saoye

#16: Post by saoye » replying to beanflying »

Not sure if they are but they provided me details of Coleman as well as John as the first port of call as their reps for offshore. In any case most manufacturers in China do not have export licence and will work through an export agents for offshore dealings, so I doubt u could work with the actual factory unless they have their own licence to export as well as deal with foreign currencies. The china government tightly controls this.

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boar_d_laze

#17: Post by boar_d_laze »

saoye wrote:For the USA and Canada I'd go through Coleman for sure and there is not much difference in price as Coleman purchases in bulk for larger discounts, however my understanding is that he only sells and reps the gas version of the 1kg from north coffee. Coleman sells the Amazon 1kg electric roaster with the analogue gauge. I initially was looking at him for the electric but realised it was 2 different roasters. Careful that you don't confuse the two. look at the weight differences.
According to Coleman -- who should know -- he can and will sell you the Northern (aka North, aka Mr. Tim) 1kg TJ-067 electric, as well as anything else you want from Northern -- including their 1kg gas as well as their other more sophisticated and/or larger roasters. Yes he also sells the Amazon (for that is its name) Royal 1000 1kg electric roaster.

I am not confusing the Northern TJ-067 Electric with the Amazon, and am aware of the weight difference.

At the time of my purchase (the Amazon), I asked Coleman about the TJ-067 electric and gas machines and he steered me away from both of them -- especially the electric -- and towards the Amazon. IMO he was trying to be helpful. Be aware -- or try to remember -- that Coleman has no actual coffee roasting experience himself.

Whether or not the Northern machines' extra 100lbs is indicative of quality, longevity, or anything else other than weight, the TJ-067s are more sophisticated than the Amazon. They offer fan and heat-power controls (and a cyclone!); while the Amazon uses venting to control both air flow and temp and a box with a screen for chaff control.

In other words the ordinary principles of control as HotTop, Quest, and Huky roasters use them -- for instance, 50% power at 50% fan -- do not apply to the Amazon. The TJ-067 is a candidate for an Arduino. The Amazon is not. Think power tool vs hand tool. Operating the Amazon is full attention, hands on, nuance driven, and a step back in time.

Roasting is a lot like extracting, in that mano and miscela (okay, mescal too) trump macchina. After countless dry runs and six roasts, I'm still finding my way with the Amazon but have calmed down to the point where I can think about what I'm doing as I'm doing it, recognize the roasting stages as they occur, make decent decisions and take good notes -- all at the same time. I'm optimistic the beast can be tamed, but am not there yet.

BDL
Drop a nickel in the pot Joe. Takin' it slow. Waiter, waiter, percolator

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saoye

#18: Post by saoye »

boar_d_laze wrote:

Roasting is a lot like extracting, in that mano and miscela (okay, mescal too) trump macchina. After countless dry runs and six roasts, I'm still finding my way with the Amazon but have calmed down to the point where I can think about what I'm doing as I'm doing it, recognize the roasting stages as they occur, make decent decisions and take good notes -- all at the same time. I'm optimistic the beast can be tamed, but am not there yet.

BDL
I don't disagree with you that experience and know-how as well as the beans makes a huge difference but I don't think anybody was arguing that. The ability to control variables always helps and this machine is by no means hand off. The additional electronics may add to potential failure compared to the basic amazon controls but just as the la pavoni Europiccola lever machine and a Rocket Giotto is different I think you will find followers in both camps and most will agree they are reasonable machines. You will still need to tweak and work on the variables and understand the beans characterisics and nuances. I have not even receive the roaster yet so I really cannot give that much input other than theory and my experience dealing with the seller, so take everything I say with a grain of salt. I do work for an appliance manufacturer and one of the basic things we do when comparing costs of a competitor with a similar product we sell is to weigh it. In most cases weight translates to additional features as well as thicker gauges of material used.
I still use my trusty corretto (breadmaker and heat gun) roaster which produces fantastic roasts and again very hands on, but I need the additional capacity for family and friends (plus the bling factor) :lol: .

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slickrock (original poster)

#19: Post by slickrock (original poster) »

beanflying wrote:Just checking in and subscribing to the thread. Mine by the way has been faultless for over a year and roasts very consistently.
Cool that you joined. I was hoping this "honeypot" of a thread would draw you in. I must say that it was your chronicle of experiences on the earlier incarnation of this roaster on the crema forum got me thinking about this beast. Do you have anything more to report on the roaster since your active posting a couple of months ago? Do you have some updated roast profiles to share? Also, are you satisfied with the location BT probe you made? Do you know the drum speed and does it seem fast enough for 1kg bean agitation? Its possible to order the unit with variable drum speed control and I was wondering what your thoughts would be on tuning drum speed (which may also affect the BT probe sweet spot).

Also, there an option to order the electrical version with solid drum. Do you think these is enough power from the heating elements to support indirect radiant heat from a solid drum? I do have a bias toward solid drums due to improved chaff containment and directional ventilation flow (back to front of the drum).
JavaMD wrote: Would you get the electric version or go for gas ... I'm leaning toward LPG - propane.
A true "roastivores" dilemma regarding this roaster.

While performance should be proved out with with user feedback, my sense is that the gas version will give you more control and capacity (beyond 1kg, most probably), since drum size is large enough to approach 2kg and gas pumps out a lot of heat with fast response. Gas roasters are more portable if you are willing to lug around a propane tank (but then again I doubt a 200lb roaster is all that portable).

But the electric version (220V assumed) seems capable at 3500W (is there any electrical roaster out there with more wattage?) with 1kg loads, based on on beanflying's experience. Also, it is a safer roaster, since I doubt the gas version has safety controls (e.g. automatic re-igniters), though I haven't verified this with the company. Also, roast automation is better here since PID/TC4 can also control power delivery more readily.
saoye wrote:I bought mine from north coffee and I just received the Bill of Lading/paperworks today. I can vouch for their communication being top notch but until I have the roaster in my possession and I am happily roasting that is as far as I will go in terms of recommendations for now.
Dillan, do let us know how the arrival of the roaster goes, assuming it's coming via North Coffee? Also, I'd like to get an idea how the latest version of the ventilation control works out (i.e. with fan on cyclone), so do share with is your initial roasting experiences. Will you be installing a BT probe right away? Artisan ready to go?
beanflying wrote:Quite surprised that there is an assumption that North Coffee actually manufactures anything? What they badge as TJ ... has been around a lot longer known as JYR-1D amongst others names and predates the North Coffee websites existence as far as I am aware
I gathered this much as well, since I found some other suppliers listed, but without any decent english-version web pages. Also, some of the roasters have "JYR" emblemed on them, so I think JYR-1DA is probably the OEM model number.
boar_d_laze wrote: Whether or not the Northern machines' extra 100lbs is indicative of quality, longevity, or anything else other than weight, the TJ-067s are more sophisticated than the Amazon. They offer fan and heat-power controls (and a cyclone!); while the Amazon uses venting to control both air flow and temp and a box with a screen for chaff control.
Roasting is a lot like extracting, in that mano and miscela (okay, mescal too) trump macchina. After countless dry runs and six roasts, I'm still finding my way with the Amazon but have calmed down to the point where I can think about what I'm doing as I'm doing it, recognize the roasting stages as they occur, make decent decisions and take good notes -- all at the same time. I'm optimistic the beast can be tamed, but am not there yet.
Thanks for providing feedback on the Amazon roaster. Finessing aside, if you can install a BT probe and hook it to Artisan, load it up to 1kg, graph the results, and share on your Amazon thread, I would look forward to how these roasters would compare.
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germantown rob

#20: Post by germantown rob »

The Toper Cafemino 1kg roaster is 5.5 kw. http://www.toper.com/e-coffee-roaster-cafemino.html

I would not make assumptions that because a drum is large you can load double the amout of capacity, most roasters can't do their maximum capacity very well. My Diedrich Ir-1 1kg roaster could easily hold 3 pounds of beans but I would have to use full heat throughout the roast and it would take closer to 20min, the result would be baked beans, not roasted beans. I mainly do 1kg batches but there are a few beans that do better to only load 2lbs to get to first crack in under 10min.

Electric vs gas. IMO gas is better. Although if there is no control over the power I guess the heat source doesn't matter much. With control over the heat source I am so glad to be done with electric element coasting, there are plenty of things to pay attention to during a roast and figuring in delay times for an electric element is something I am glad I no longer have to think about.