Bullet Roast Along-Brazil: Lagender or etc - Page 3

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.
pcofftenyo (original poster)
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#21: Post by pcofftenyo (original poster) »

Hey Sam- Ya'll can post up your Ikawa roasts here too if you want even though it's a little OT. Also, thanks for participating!

Here's my best Brazil Rose Diamond roast to date. Initial problems with it were related due to too-high drop temps. After about 205C drop at 1:30 this gets pretty ashy for me. I had initially thought it to be tipping/scorching but that wasn't it. It was surprisingly more done than it looked.

It's only 3 days post roast but it has a pleasant full body, gentle sweetness, modest acidity, milk and medium chocolates: some cherry mash flavorings without the sugar intensity.

-TP and early slope are a lot different on the Bullet from the Huky.

-Have been progressively raising charge temp: will bump again.

-It's a little long in the middle so need to shorten this a bit (see above).

-It can get a little humpy appx 2 min/30C before 1C so need a bigger heat dip there.


sambuist

#22: Post by sambuist »

that is looking really good. and if it is tasting nice then that is grerat. one thing i do notice is that you are changing your power a lot during the roast which could be hard to repeat. i would recommend trying to recrate the same profile with less power changes as this will be a less involved roasting method that might be more repeatable.

as an example here is the link to my batch 2 - https://roast.world/@don.tomlinson/roas ... 57hn_Na-mn

maybe pull that over to your machine and display it in the background on the software to guide you. it wont be perfect and it is by no means better than yours but it has less power changes which would make it "easier" . its worth a try. the key is the higher charge temp to allow that momentum to build in the bean at the start therefore all you have to do it decrease the power throughout and increase the fan (a little).

as for the IKAWA - here is the link to that thread. its prob best to keep them separate as they are about slightly different things. on that thread im trying to compare the decreasing ROR style roasting which is common on drum roasters, with the native IKAWA curves (fluid bed roaster) which are very different and thanks to another contributor (GDM528) we can see that the IKAWA ROR is VERY different. as a side not, the IKAWA only roasts via the inlet temp (basically the drum/environment temp on the bullet) so you create a profile and then send it to the machine and via a PID it follows that drum temp for the roast. very interesting and very hands off. you hit go and then come back 10mins later to collect your beans.
Ikawa Home vs Bullet

pcofftenyo (original poster)
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#23: Post by pcofftenyo (original poster) »

Thanks for the link. I'll pull that in.

As for the temp changes: Its quite a transition from the super responsive Huky to the slower response Bullet.

As for charge temp: working my way up there. It was important to start low to eliminate tipping/scorching as a possible reason for the horribly ashy roasts. This was concluded to be end temp over 205C although obviously all actions culminate there.

I never roast Brazil's or other low/soft beans for that matter. At 950 - 1150 MASL this behaves quite a bit differently than the typical high elevation bean I buy (1650 masl seems to be my level retrospectively although I don't have that as a mental point)

This ain't a roast and learn for nothin! :D

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mkane

#24: Post by mkane »


I gave it a couple of shots. All the gas changes on the second try really made the MET wonky

pcofftenyo (original poster)
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#25: Post by pcofftenyo (original poster) »

Your Buckeye can produce a bunch of heat Mike.

It'll be interesting to hear your results in a few days.

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Chert

#26: Post by Chert »

pcofftenyo wrote: After about 205C drop at 1:30 this gets pretty ashy for me. I had initially thought it to be tipping/scorching but that wasn't it. It was surprisingly more done than it looked.
I was thinking about this tasty roast you did, with the question what is "ashy". I get a taste in some fairly light roasts usually as espresso that seem ashy, but of course roasted notes come in stronger after further development and at higher drop temps. I think they can show up in both, even when one doesn't see tipping or scorching. At least I think so. But isn't the best darker roast also not ashy, despite being dark roasted.

So what is ashy? Is it a defect that comes up in roast discussion, like baked ?
LMWDP #198

pcofftenyo (original poster)
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#27: Post by pcofftenyo (original poster) » replying to Chert »

I think ashy comes up as a discussion item from time to time. There's chatter about it being related to MET. DaveB has mentioned sensitivity to it:

I can only describe ashy as "bleck". Burnt or charred meat or vegetables like when the gas grill goes haywire because the grease has accumulated and catches fire. The roasted bean aroma is awful with the colors NOT as dark as one would think.

I'm not precisely sure what tipping/scorching tastes like so I can't comment on that.

I know what under developed is. Grassy, hay-like.

I know what baked flavors are: got them all the time with my Behmor. Flat, lifeless.

Since this is a roast and learn, I'm learning that with this soft, 950 - 1150 MASL bean even a 205C drop temp after 1:30 development is too long. I'll shorten the time by 15 seconds next round and/or lower the drop temp to 204.

For clarity: I'm partly deaf and can't hear F-all inside this Bullet. My noisy Huky with the grindy bearing howling away was there was always much more crack clarity except with a Pacamara. I have taken to standardizing for the immediate goal of replicability and simplicity marking yellow @ 150 although it sure looks a lot sooner, 1C at 200, and drop where it is.

Also, this Bullet starts spinning off chaff early with yellowing beginning after appx 2 minutes. Same bean in the Huky with the trier it's about 4 minutes to yellow with no chaff in the tryer until later on.

pcofftenyo (original poster)
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#28: Post by pcofftenyo (original poster) »

mkane wrote: I gave it a couple of shots. All the gas changes on the second try really made the MET wonky
I've seen chatter about a declining MET resulting in some unpleasant/funky cups: I don't measure it but wondering what you notice, particularly with this bean?

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Chert

#29: Post by Chert »

pcofftenyo wrote:I think ashy comes up as a discussion item from time to time. There's chatter about it being related to MET. DaveB has mentioned sensitivity to it:

I can only describe ashy as "bleck". Burnt or charred meat or vegetables like when the gas grill goes haywire because the grease has accumulated and catches fire. The roasted bean aroma is awful with the colors NOT as dark as one would think.

I'm not precisely sure what tipping/scorching tastes like so I can't comment on that.

I know what under developed is. Grassy, hay-like.

I know what baked flavors are: got them all the time with my Behmor. Flat, lifeless.

Since this is a roast and learn, I'm learning that with this soft, 950 - 1150 MASL bean even a 205C drop temp after 1:30 development is too long. I'll shorten the time by 15 seconds next round and/or lower the drop temp to 204.

For clarity: I'm partly deaf and can't hear F-all inside this Bullet. My noisy Huky with the grindy bearing howling away was there was always much more crack clarity except with a Pacamara. I have taken to standardizing for the immediate goal of replicability and simplicity marking yellow @ 150 although it sure looks a lot sooner, 1C at 200, and drop where it is.

Also, this Bullet starts spinning off chaff early with yellowing beginning after appx 2 minutes. Same bean in the Huky with the trier it's about 4 minutes to yellow with no chaff in the tryer until later on.
Interesting.
I wonder if the length of ramp is contributing to the ashiness you describe. I would shoot for the same or nearly same drop temp but ramp 3.25 - 4 minutes.
LMWDP #198

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mkane

#30: Post by mkane »

I tried roast 1365 this morning as a PO. Drinkable but not my style. Tastes like roasted coffee. Could be described as ashy. Defiantly not smoke, maybe light toast as I had plenty of airflow. The roasted beans look fantastic. About a C+.

These beans seem stubborn. Especially during Mailliard. I usually struggle here and blast right on through, but these beans seem to stall here. I too have a hard time hearing 1C with these.

I'll try the other in the morning.