Any suggestions for Ethiopian Gera Nano Challa?

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.
capt_jack11
Posts: 13
Joined: 2 years ago

#1: Post by capt_jack11 »

In addition to general feedback I'd appreciate suggestions for:

1. Extending the Maillard phase. I've not had luck getting this to 35% of the roast time. It's usually between 25-28% regardless of the starting temperature and tastes rather flat. I also cannot get the Development phase below 26%.

2. Avoiding the crash and flick. Perhaps my adjustments are not drastic enough but this is consistently happening to me.


ShotClock
Supporter ♡
Posts: 450
Joined: 3 years ago

#2: Post by ShotClock »

Hi there, as a fellow Cormorant user, a couple of things stand out to me.

You are charging at a very low temperature. I normally charge at 400 just to fix a parameter. I've read that assuming to charge at the drop temp is a good strategy, so 400 should be in the ballpark for you too.

I imagine that you might drop your initial gas setting to 25 or so to compensate for more heat in the drum to begin with, hopefully this will get you through to 300 faster, but when you cut gas just after, maillard will be slowed down.

What is your air set to? I've found that it makes a huge difference to the thermal power that the drum sees, and too low an air setting can give a roasty, smoky flavor that is not pleasant. I'm using 8v all of the time, again just to remove a parameter.

How long is your warm up? I try to warm up to 420 or so with max gas, then cut the gas and let BT cool to 350, before warming to my charge temp with gas at 25 mbar, where i will start my roast.

For gas changes, i find that two cuts to 20 and 15mbar are normally sufficient, though sometimes I use another to 10. Timing is key, but aiming to make the final cut 1 minute or so before 1C has been useful for me.

Another thing is the smoothing in artisan. I've found that removing all smoothing gives me the most information. I find that i can see through the noise more easily than the artifacts created by the smoothing.

Advertisement
User avatar
Brewzologist
Supporter ♡
Posts: 1179
Joined: 7 years ago

#3: Post by Brewzologist »

I don't have a Cormorant roaster, so take these ideas with a grain of salt. I find Africans generally roast best if you load heat into the beans early and then reduce heat a bit more agressively for the rest of the roast. This is a technical approach that will get you in the ballpark of a good roast, but of course taste/tweak from there.

1) Charge higher as ShotClock recommends.
2) After TP try to reach around 40F/min BT RoR and then reduce gas more steeply, shooting for DE around the same time as your profile: 4-5min.
3) Continue reducing gas more after DE going for a steeper decline on the BT RoR line. This will help get that 35% Maillard phase you're wanting.
4) Try to enter FCs around 10-15F/min, making your last gas change no later than about 45sec before FCs. (Somewhat counterintuitively, to reduce crash after FCs it helps to reduce gas and/or make the gas change earlier before FCs). This will also help reduce propensity of the flick after the crash.
5) After FCs, reducing the flick is often a matter of judicious gas changes moving toward an off state. On my roaster I find the ET RoR line provides early indication of what BT RoR will do next so I tend to look at that a lot.
6) Also it appears you increased the fan 10-15sec before drop, which can increase convection causing a spike in RoR, so would suggest leaving it alone except perhaps right before drop to evacuate smoke.

EDIT: Also noted you appear to be roasting quite dark. I'm typically a light-med roast guy so my recommendations above are for this approach. Roasting dark brings its own challenges so you may want to review this thread: Roasting dark: 'S' curve vs constant declining RoR?

By way of example only, see the following Ethiopian roast profile re: my points above. HTH


ShotClock
Supporter ♡
Posts: 450
Joined: 3 years ago

#4: Post by ShotClock »

Just checked a successful recent roast as posted here.

Actually, i charged at 400 with the gas at 15, soaked until TP or so, then went to 25 mbar, and made 3 cuts with the final one being 30 sec or so before 1C.

I'm by no means an expert, but have found this to be a decent template for fruity light roasts. My guess is that you start with too little heat in the drum before charging, then add too much to catch up, leading to ripping through maillard.

One reason that i made only 3 gas cuts on the roast above is that it reduces the dimension of the problem. Since I always make my first cut at 320F, and always cut by 5 mbar, i only have two decisions to make. I've found that this can be amazingly flexible, without the problems with a huge parameter space that plagued me early on. I'd highly recommend seeing air to 8V and leaving it, and also just leaving the damper open. I'm sure that these useful for more expert roasters, but have found that for a novice like me, it's much better to just leave them alone.

capt_jack11 (original poster)
Posts: 13
Joined: 2 years ago

#5: Post by capt_jack11 (original poster) »

This is great feedback so far. Thanks everyone!

capt_jack11 (original poster)
Posts: 13
Joined: 2 years ago

#6: Post by capt_jack11 (original poster) »

Shotclock, I've had two "successful" roasts following your suggestions! Definitely set me in the right direction.

1. Why do you make your first cut at 320? That seems to not leave much time to make a second cut before 1C.

2. What weight are you charging at? I've seen suggestions for less beans, some for more. Currently I'm charging at 350g.

User avatar
LBIespresso
Supporter ❤
Posts: 1249
Joined: 7 years ago

#7: Post by LBIespresso »

Fellow Cormorant owner here...sorry for the late reply.

I really like roasting 500 grams but since 454ish is a pound and I typically order by the pound I have settled on 454 as my standard batch size. I think 350 is OK but I wouldn't go smaller than 300 and I think you might see better data with bigger batches.

As for your crash and flick, this was a confounding problem for me when I started. More the crash than the flick but crash does often lead to flick. Not just Ethiopians, but damn near everything. I don't know why and most advice from others was somewhat helpful but it was trial and error that brought me my best answer yet. I make my last gas cut before FC MUCH MUCH larger than I think I need. At least much larger than I thought I needed since now I have a better grip on the right size cut. I have theories on why this works but WTH do I know? I know this works for me and that's all I need. Maybe it will for you too?

If it helps here is a Red Haraaz I roasted 2 days ago. This was my first go at this coffee so if anyone has any advice to improve it, I'm all ears!


Oh, yeah, I'm using 3.2mm RTD probes
LMWDP #580

Advertisement
Milligan
Supporter ❤
Posts: 1529
Joined: 2 years ago

#8: Post by Milligan »

How did you mark 1C? The first crack you heard or a few cracks in succession? If you mark it by the trough in the ET ROR curve near your FC mark then your maillard phase was actually a little closer to your target.

Trjelenc
Posts: 160
Joined: 4 years ago

#9: Post by Trjelenc »

I think the most important question coming from your graph worth asking is "what was your goal from this roast?". As previously mentioned, you're roasting this bean decently dark. On my machine, +40F after beginning of first crack would put me at second crack beginning and I think most people buying this bean would keep it light to preserve as much as it has to offer. Were you intending a dark roast for this bean?

If you weren't, that would be your biggest bang for your buck change to your roast profile: drop earlier at lower temp. Getting the roast slowed prior to first crack in order to coast in at 2 minutes and 15-20F of development is a good starting point IF you want light-medium.

And like someone else mentioned about reducing heat more than you think, I also find that around 40F before first crack starts, the roast feels exothermic and carries momentum very heavily, so if im late on a gas drop or not enough gas drop, the damn thing just doesn't want to slow down going into first, until first crack happens and the RoR finally plummets

ShotClock
Supporter ♡
Posts: 450
Joined: 3 years ago

#10: Post by ShotClock »

Hi Jackson,

I'm currently working with 300g charges every time. This is due to the fact that we don't drink a huge amount of coffee, and I'd like to get more roasts in. I've tried smaller than 300g, but the temperature data seems to get inconsistent with the probe placement on my roaster.

I make my first cut at 320 as it seems like a popular choice - the coffee seems to be fully yellowed by then, and it removes another parameter if I do it that way every time. I actually have plenty of time to get two cuts in before 1C, as you can see from my curves.

Here's a recent roast of a Costa Rico Finca La Bella natural. It's about as light as I normally roast, and worked out really well. I was experimenting with a lower air setting in the first half of the roast, but don't think it makes much difference.



With these gas settings and a similar coffee, I can get almost to 2C with a natural. Just choosing drop temp gives quite a range of choices. It seems like a washed coffee needs a bit more gas to start, I've not had as much success with those recently. I often use this as a starting point, as there are several different directions that I can take the roast from here without getting lost in the parameter space. As previously stated, I'm very much a beginner, and have found the help here very useful. Maybe posting some of your updated curves and your tasting notes would be useful?

I've also found good results from roasting, then cupping, and roasting the same coffee again the next day, trying to implement the changes based on my interpretation of the curves, and tasting. I've blown through quite a lot of beans this way, but it seems to accelerate progress quite well. Another reason for smaller roasts - you get more practise, more feedback, faster improvement.

Post Reply