Anaerobic natural coffees - Page 5

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.
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Chert
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#41: Post by Chert »

I roasted last weekend 100 g sample of the Colombian anaerobic tabi from Bodhi leaf that inspired the OP, mpdeem, (I hope all is well with them).

It was early in my use of the Huky 100 g charges and I roasted it too light. I will let it rest another few days before grinding and cupping. The smell of the roasted beans is just foul. I raise my eyebrows and shake my head and sigh a little to read about coffee with a bin juice character. I had never considered such words to describe coffee before, but for this erroneous sample roast, they are good choices.

One of the One of A Kind Guatemala samples I roasted was really unpleasant, but with 4 weeks rest the flavor profile has improved very much. There is a refrain among light roast afficionados: "let it rest" that can serve some coffees quite well.

So I will let tabi rest.
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chuckcoffee
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#42: Post by chuckcoffee »

Chert

I had tried once roasting 100gr on the Huky but got a lot of variability on my BT I figured due to poor probe coverage.

Have you had that issue?

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weebit_nutty
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#43: Post by weebit_nutty »

My take on anaerobic process has been very positive. In fact I've gone so far as to say it has become my favorite process as of yet. Previously honey process, but anaerobic really takes things up a notch.

It isn't for everyone, but for those who love strong fruit and umami notes, it's not just in the ballpark, it is the ballpark :lol:

The last couple of roasts I've had have been stellar, both from Ethiopia. One was a Uraga Guji Grade 1, and the other, Yirgacheffe Worka Grade 1. I was so impressed I sent thank you texts to Klatch for their greens quality.

Some of you that didn't have very good impression should try the greens above, from Klatch. (ps. I've never had any decent roasts from Bodhi Leaf, and have long since dropped them as my greens source, despite the convenience of them being local to where I live, but this is besides my point. I don't mean to knock them perhaps I just got better at roasting since? lol Anyway if you have good experience by all means keep using them).
You're not always right, but when you're right, you're right, right?

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Chert
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#44: Post by Chert »

chuckcoffee wrote:Chert

I had tried once roasting 100gr on the Huky but got a lot of variability on my BT I figured due to poor probe coverage.

Have you had that issue?
Your experience mirrors mine.

I'm doing a series of 29 100g samples. The gas and fan settings , charge temp and drop as well as roast duration one obviously can control but BT becomes a second, different placement of ET; i suppose MET may provide some point of reproducibility. RoR curve is really weird. It takes one back to reliance on coffee color during the roast.

I dropped a roast at "BT" 227 C at 9 minutes and it scaled by tonino at light 127 like a 360g dropped at 208C.

It's helpful that I'm doing the same charge repeatedly with great coffee. I do 3 back to back, cup, adjust my plan and do 3 more within a couple of days.
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mpdeem (original poster)
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#45: Post by mpdeem (original poster) »

Chert wrote:I roasted last weekend 100 g sample of the Colombian anaerobic tabi from Bodhi leaf that inspired the OP, mpdeem, (I hope all is well with them).

It was early in my use of the Huky 100 g charges and I roasted it too light. I will let it rest another few days before grinding and cupping. The smell of the roasted beans is just foul. I raise my eyebrows and shake my head and sigh a little to read about coffee with a bin juice character. I had never considered such words to describe coffee before, but for this erroneous sample roast, they are good choices.
After a very busy summer I am only now getting around to catching up here. I confess to feeling both validated and guilty after reading the above impression of the Colombian anaerobic from Bohdi. Validated because it echoes my exact impression, 'bin juice' being an apt descriptor indeed. I did feel rather guilty since Chert bravely offered to try this coffee on my behalf. In hindsight perhaps I should have packaged the sample in a biohazard bag and marked it 'bin juice' to inspire extreme caution when sampling. Thank you Chert for being so generous and brave. I am not even sure my closest friends would have offered to take on such an unpleasant endeavor.

I feel even worse since all summer long, I have been enjoying the fabulous Brazil El Paraiso Pulped while Chert has been stuck tasting rancid bin juice. Having said that, I am delighted to meet such a wonderful example of this type of coffee. The only down side is that I fear no other coffee will ever begin to approach the lofty heights of the El Paraiso.....

I will read through the rest of the thread and respond accordingly. Sorry to be MIA but it has been a busier summer than I anticipate..plus I tend to spend all my free time outdoors during spring and summer, enjoying the warm weather before the fall arrives and spector of another cold Indiana winter looms on the horizon. For now I want to thank everyone who repsonded to this thread for never in my coffee journey have I come across a process that has such variance in results - from bin juice to the sublime! Your feedback and suggestions will be helpful in navigating future samples.

Mary

mpdeem (original poster)
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#46: Post by mpdeem (original poster) »

The last couple of roasts I've had have been stellar, both from Ethiopia. One was a Uraga Guji Grade 1, and the other, Yirgacheffe Worka Grade 1. I was so impressed I sent thank you texts to Klatch for their greens quality.

Some of you that didn't have very good impression should try the greens above, from Klatch. (ps. I've never had any decent roasts from Bodhi Leaf, and have long since dropped them as my greens source, despite the convenience of them being local to where I live, but this is besides my point. I don't mean to knock them perhaps I just got better at roasting since? lol Anyway if you have good experience by all means keep using them).[/quote]

Thank you for sharing your impressions. I did briefly consider trying a few more anaerobics from Bohdi but decided against it given how much I dislked the ones tried thus far...so I apperciate your comments. I am limited to one cup of coffee daily and while I am adventerous person, I do not want to spend wekks on end tasting through an array of medicore (or downright rancid) tasting coffees. As a result I tend to stick with vendors whose tastes are nmore closely aligned with my own. I don't expect to like every coffee offered..but there is a point where I decide to move on after trying so many coffees.

One of the reasons that I posted here was for clarity regarding my reaction: is this is a matter of me just not like anaerobic process coffees or it is just this particular selection of coffees. I am happy to say that I have discovered that it is possible not only to like but love an anaerobic coffee (the El Paraiso pulped -thank you Chert)...as well as a nice example of an anaerobic Colombian from Burmans (name escapes me -sadly I tossed the empty bag before reazing the coffee was sold out). The El Paraiso has literally been my 'desert island' coffee over the summmer...literally my daily drinker alternating only with Aida Batlle's Cascara Tea process. Actually those two made for very interesting companions to compare from day to day -but that is for another thread...

I will try Klatch next and report back here :)

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#47: Post by mpdeem (original poster) »

luca wrote:They differ a lot, and I'd say that "carbonic maceration" and "anaerobic" really aren't very descriptive; you need more information. What I'd say is that the vast majority of these coffees that I've tasted have one or more of the following:
1. some sort of unclean fermented quality, often balsamic vinegar, often something that smells like the juice that drips from a garbage bin on a hot day;
2. some sort of savoury quality, like miso or whatever; and/or
3. some sort of over-the-top non-fruit quality, like sharpies or salted liquorice.
Thank you for such a detailed response, my apologies for only now responding..been a much busier summer than anticipated so I've not been online much. I especially appreciate such succinct catagories in describing the shared commonalities of anaerobic you've tasted. Seems to perfectly capture the characteristics of anaerobic while also illustrating the less appealing points of this process.

Your description"juice that drips from a garbage bin on a hot day" is both accurate and quite lyrical. I nominate that it be added to the Official List of Coffee Terminology. Readiing it not only captured my impressions of the Bodhi Leaf anaerobic perfectly- but also bought back childhood memories of NYC during the garbage strike. Who needs Proust's Madelines when fermented bin juice to evoke memories of one's youth.

You mention na anaerobic washed geisha from Abu coffee in Panama. Roastmasters has offered an Abu Panama gesha recently but I missed out on it - and am not certain of the process. I realize that you probably got yours from a different source given your location...but would still enjoy hearing more about the version you had.

I have tried Finca Elida's Torres Lot gesha which I think had anaerobic processing although in a very subte 'more natural than anaerobic' flavors. I would love to try more Elida anaerobic if available.

Savage coffees/Finca Deborah - you mention contacting them regarding a sampler pack. Did you ever find out if they do? I am not familiar with them but tlove the he idea alone of a sampler pack of different anaerobic from one producer. I struggle to figure out the array of 'anaerobic' processes for the very reasons you mention. Carbonic maturation versus 72 hour ferment and so forth are hard to decipher with such a new (to me anyway) process especially given the lack of descriptor regarding conditions under which said anaerobic processes occurred. Suddenly I envision a dumpster full of plastic bags full of soggy fermenting beans...which is why I adore your descriptor 'bin juice'.

Thanks for such detailed replies - sorry again for the long overdue response.

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#48: Post by mpdeem (original poster) »

Colombian Cauca - Manos Juntas Micromill Pacamara Anaerobic Natural from Burman but now sadly sold out. Really nice more like a natural with slightly winey deeper red fruits. Absolutely no soy/miso or vinager notes. Nothing at all like the anaerobic naturals from Bodhi Leaf. I would have gladly stocked up on more but it was sold out.

Burman just got a striped red bourbon anaerobic natural from this producer which I ordered along with their regular Natural. Will post here once it arrives.

GDM528
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#49: Post by GDM528 »

Is there a general roasting strategy for anaerobic, compared to their natural equivalents? My specific challenge is how to move from Panama Elida natural Catuai to their "Anaerobic Slow Dry" natural Catuai.

For an espresso roasts, do anaerobics warrant a lighter roast (shorter, lower temps) - or should I be thinking about roasting out potentially objectionable "bin juice" notes?

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mkane
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#50: Post by mkane »

I wonder why all the different processing methods these days. Surely not something drummed up by the grower.

I'm still trying to figure out what bin juice tastes like.