A few things may affect the temperature offset; the location of the thermocouple in the thermowell, ambient temperature, temperature of the water in the pourover reservoir, whether the machine sits near a heating/cooling vent, perhaps even the OPV setting.

The thought also occurred to me that Chris could offer an offset measurement service, but it may not make much sense with those variables. You should be able to quickly hone in on desired setpoints based on taste.

That said, I would like to program the offset into the PID display, just for my own use . I'm certain that can be done, but I haven't broken out the manual.

(BTW, both Dan and I have an Alexia for this review, so they are different machines).

For what it's worth, I have a PID'ed Alexia (different kit than Chris' and professionally installed by third party) and I have found my optimum SV to be around 216 deg F. This value was right in the middle of the range suggested by the installer (210 - 220 deg F). After reading this thread, I have started using warming flushes, but to be honest I didn't find that they made a noticeable taste difference over just pulling from idle. I do not claim to have extremely refined taste sensitivity, but I begin to detect sourness when I drop the SV below 214 deg F and bitterness when I go above 218 deg F.

Thanks very much for all of the work and detailed information presented. It's been a huge help to me.

I know we are only talking ± 2 degrees. I know pulling that perfect shot is not an exact science with so much potential for user error among the steps required.
My real bottom line question is, do I personally, need the PID? I have decided that I definitely do whether it's on my present Silvia or if I order a new ALEXIA with the PID installed.
Thanks for all the hard work and being patient with my inane questions.

Beavis wrote:My real bottom line question is, do I personally, need the PID?

I believe there is already ample information presented in the prior posts for you to make an informed decision. I cannot say whether you personally would consider it money well spent, but if it helps...

HB wrote:If it were my money, I'd get the PID'd version of the Alexia over stock.

Quick Mill Alexia - PID Use, Part 2 - Intershot Performance

Here are 2 graphs showing intershot performance. This procedure was used:

• Warmed machine with portafilter and Scace thermofilter installed for 60 minutes minimum,
• Portafilter removed and pulled a warming flush of ~3 ounces,
• 2 minute recovery and then pulled a "garbage" simulated shot
• Pulled 5 shots with 2 minute recovery between shots, start dump (SD) of thermofilter for each shot,
• 3 minute recovery and pulled a long shot (60 seconds),
• 3 minute recovery and pulled a second long shot

The first graph shows the 5 shots with two minute recovery times, and the second graph adds the longer shots as well.


Click for full size


Click for full size

I think you will agree these show some very good consistency and 2 minutes for recovery is pretty impressive. I did not try a shorter recovery period, my opinion is that 2 minutes is plenty fast for most home baristas.

Data available on request.

jesawdy wrote:Those who are upgrading from Silvia or similar class machine are going to love this part. My "daily driver" machine for the last 14 months or so has been the Rancilio Silvia. Now, don't get me wrong, I think the Silvia is a well built machine. It has often been said that Silvia is a "harsh mistress", and I think she is. My personal experience in the first few days on Alexia is that you can hardly go wrong, comparatively speaking. I've joked before that preinfusion is for wussies, but it sure makes things simpler! I've also used a few other commercial class machines without E61 preinfusion, and they aren't as forgiving as the Alexia.

I have to second this sentiment. Currently I have Alexia & Silvia on demo in my shop - side by side. I probably don't need to tell you that my shots are coming from Alexia. She is more forgiving, quiet, beautiful and consistent... I think I love her!

Many of my walk in customers are wanting the Silvia (for the price point) and I hate trying to 'sell up' because it seems so pushy... But I can't sleep well at night if I don't demonstrate the 2 units side by side - even if most people will not buy up in the end.

I will try to do some side by side pic's

greatinfusions wrote:Many of my walk in customers are wanting the Silvia (for the price point) and I hate trying to 'sell up' because it seems so pushy... But I can't sleep well at night if I don't demonstrate the 2 units side by side - even if most people will not buy up in the end.

I will try to do some side by side pic's

Sebastian, thanks for the comments. I intend to add some side-by-side comparisons of Silvia and Alexia during the next week.

After almost 2 months of being relegated to the basement floor, the Silvia is back in action with Eric's grouphead thermocouple adapter reinstalled (I shamelessly ripped the thermocouple out when I needed one awhile back). She is descaling at the moment and will be ready for a few sessions tomorrow.

I can give Silvia complaint number one.... portafilter lock-in. Locking in the portafilter on the Silvia usually requires reaching for the case to keep it from scooting across the counter. I haven't had to reach for the Alexia once .

Here it is - The ultimate smack down between a "harsh mistress" & a smooth seductress - like 2 Italian she-tigers in a mud wrestling match. Alexia is more beautiful out of the box... Her proportions are very nice and she has a subtle beauty. Silvia is businesslike in appearance... in a good way. Coffee was Josuma Malabar Gold & grinder was MACAP M4.


HBers know all the spec's but I will quickly remind you of the basics:

Rancilio Silvia:
List $600
67 oz. Water Tank
12 oz. drip pan
12 oz. Brass Boiler
Ulka 52 watt vibratory pump
Power: 1100 watts - 120 volts
Size: 13.25"H x 11.25"W x 9.25"D
Weight: 30 pounds
Materials: Steel frame, stainless housing,
Origin: Italy

Quickmill Alexia:
List $895
E-61 commercial group
25 oz. single boiler
Thermosyphon circulation
Ulka 52 watt vibratory pump
Lever Action Semi-Automatic
Water reservoir 3 liters (101 oz)
46 ounce capacity drip tray with
Dual purpose pressure gauge
Low water level safety switch
1400 watt heating element
Weight 38 lbs.
W: 9" D: 179" H: 15 1/4"
Origin: Italy

So first let's look at them side by side:


And profile:


Top view:


Shots were poured using the same volume 14gr. of Malabar Gold in a standard 14gr LM basket with bottomless PF into a 3oz ACF espresso cup:

Rancilio shot:


Alexia shot:


Now for the glass cup profile into a 3 oz. Bormioli Roma cup:

Rancilio:


Alexia:


Tasting Notes:
This was a lot of fun. Both of these girls did well and I believe both can provide a heck of a good shot when paired with good coffee and a bit of practice. The shots were almost indistinguishable in taste. Both produced the aromatic Italian style espresso you want with Malabar Gold. Alexia's shots were more spotted and in fact had an ever so slight edge in taste - just a little more punch.

Joy of use:
This is hands down winner for Alexia. Quieter and more refined in every way with the beautiful E61 group and nicely curved panels. She boasts 4 x the volume in drip tray 2 x the boiler size & about 30% larger reservoir. The lever switch is much more interesting and refined than the rocker on Silvia. The auto shot off for low water is a comfort. Pressure gauge & temp setting (under the hood) are both big pluses...

Final word:
Is Alexia worth the extra $300?
(Not if you are taking that out of your grinder budget)

But - If you have the money and you want a well crafted espresso machine that looks as good as it cooks - I would give it serious consideration.

Hmm, same thing here today.... Silvia versus Alexia.


PID Rancilio Silvia and PID Quick Mill Alexia


Silvia (left), Alexia (right), 14g dose, ~30 sec from pump on for shot time, pulled simultaneously (who needs a 2-group ?)

I'm curious, did you find a need to change the grind setting between the two? I think I will get away with same setting.

Also, when I open the refrigerator door.... I can watch the fridge light pulse with the PID controllers .

jesawdy wrote:I'm curious, did you find a need to change the grind setting between the two? I think I will get away with same setting.

I used the same grind setting. I have tried a step finer on Silvia as well but got overextracted shots.