Rocket Mozzafiato brew pressure solenoid jammed? - Page 2
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- Posts: 12
- Joined: 9 years ago
The dealer got back to me and also confirmed the 9 bar of pressure is normal without any coffee puck or blind filter loading. I understand all the comments so thanks to everyone for their input.
Still, it seems strange to me on a well-regarded machine like this, why Rocket would choose to connect the pressure gauge to the pump output manifold, rather than the E61 group head manifold. As an espresso enthusiast, I care about brew pressure. To accurately monitor it on this machine looks like I need to buy an aftermarket pressure gauge and connect it to the group head. Makes no sense to me that the machine already has a pressure gauge but it doesn't show the brew pressure, which is what you're most interested in! But I suppose that's how it is, so c'est la vie!
I opened the E61 group head to inspect it for scale or other blockages. Everything looked OK to me.
I assume the gicleur is the small 6-sided brown insert in the center of this next photo?
The gicleur jet and the other 4 tiny holes were all clean and free from particles or scale, so I think my E61 is in good condition.
Also seems my machine has the ceramic mushroom fitted. I was not able to remove it.
Still, it seems strange to me on a well-regarded machine like this, why Rocket would choose to connect the pressure gauge to the pump output manifold, rather than the E61 group head manifold. As an espresso enthusiast, I care about brew pressure. To accurately monitor it on this machine looks like I need to buy an aftermarket pressure gauge and connect it to the group head. Makes no sense to me that the machine already has a pressure gauge but it doesn't show the brew pressure, which is what you're most interested in! But I suppose that's how it is, so c'est la vie!
I opened the E61 group head to inspect it for scale or other blockages. Everything looked OK to me.
I assume the gicleur is the small 6-sided brown insert in the center of this next photo?
The gicleur jet and the other 4 tiny holes were all clean and free from particles or scale, so I think my E61 is in good condition.
Also seems my machine has the ceramic mushroom fitted. I was not able to remove it.
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- Team HB
- Posts: 3714
- Joined: 5 years ago
Why is it strange? Doing something the tried and true way that has worked for 40+ years is very common.
What would be strange would be to make a drastic change to something as common as the E61 brewhead for the sole purpose of "Making an unwanted change", with the potential of creating a machine that would constantly jam a gauge or pipette with coffee oils/grounds. The Mozzafiato came in to replace the Giotto and Cellini lines with a "Best of Both Machines" new model. The last thing it needs is to change things and potentially have a machine everybody hates.
And, for what it's worth, "What I'm most interested in" isn't brew pressure. While it wouldn't hurt to have a gauge there to glance at, I believe a thermometer would be a more useful instrument in the head. Having the brew-circuit gauge at the manifold is nice, it comforts you with the knowledge that everything is working as intended when you see it ramp right up and assume its normal position while the pump is working, but it's not a critical component for brewing. It's nice for trouble-shooting, it can tell you a lot when something is wrong with the machine, but most commonly it's there to show that nothing's wrong.
The flow of espresso and the flavour of it are the more accurate gauge of brew pressure.
What would be strange would be to make a drastic change to something as common as the E61 brewhead for the sole purpose of "Making an unwanted change", with the potential of creating a machine that would constantly jam a gauge or pipette with coffee oils/grounds. The Mozzafiato came in to replace the Giotto and Cellini lines with a "Best of Both Machines" new model. The last thing it needs is to change things and potentially have a machine everybody hates.
And, for what it's worth, "What I'm most interested in" isn't brew pressure. While it wouldn't hurt to have a gauge there to glance at, I believe a thermometer would be a more useful instrument in the head. Having the brew-circuit gauge at the manifold is nice, it comforts you with the knowledge that everything is working as intended when you see it ramp right up and assume its normal position while the pump is working, but it's not a critical component for brewing. It's nice for trouble-shooting, it can tell you a lot when something is wrong with the machine, but most commonly it's there to show that nothing's wrong.
The flow of espresso and the flavour of it are the more accurate gauge of brew pressure.
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- Posts: 12
- Joined: 9 years ago
I'm an engineer so I look at things differently to other people. From my 30+ years experience making espresso daily I've learned that brew temperature (as you say), as well as brew pressure are the 2 most important dynamic parameters to monitor (as physically closely as possible to the coffee puck) during an extraction, with flow rate probably coming in a valuable third. As an engineer, I want to see dials on my machine that display these key parameters, in real time, as accurately as commercially feasible, as the shot is extracted. This is the raison d'être of the Scace device. I am not interested in analagous data about what's happening elsewhere in the machine, that, for example, might require lookup tables to derive the real actual values (eg Rocket with its PID temperature). It's pretty simple. The challenge to all these machine makers is to find solutions to the considerable engineering challenges like "jamming a gauge with coffee oils" by connecting a pressure gauge at the brew head.
So I stand by my original opinion. Rocket have chosen to design a machine whose PID does not read actual brew temperature, and, as I have learned from this thread, whose pressure gauge does not read actual brew pressure. Take that as you will.
However we can agree that ultimately it IS all about the taste and flavour of each shot you make. IMHO it's easier to improve your technique, debug bad shots, and share extraction profiles & recipes with others when you have instruments on your machine that read out actual values of the things that matter. In that respect I'd say the pressure gauge on the Rocket is a total waste of space and money, and that it just fulfills a role as eye candy on the admittedly beautiful chromed facade of the machine! It's my opinion, but personally I could care less that the pressure on the output stage of the pump is 9 bars when what I want to know is the pressure of the water being forced through the coffee puck (in addition to temperature and flow rate etc.)
I think also the realization of the importance of accurately monitoring, displaying & recording these key dynamic extraction parameters is what's driving the design philosophy of newer machines like the Descent and gadgets like the Smart Espresso Profiler.
So I stand by my original opinion. Rocket have chosen to design a machine whose PID does not read actual brew temperature, and, as I have learned from this thread, whose pressure gauge does not read actual brew pressure. Take that as you will.
However we can agree that ultimately it IS all about the taste and flavour of each shot you make. IMHO it's easier to improve your technique, debug bad shots, and share extraction profiles & recipes with others when you have instruments on your machine that read out actual values of the things that matter. In that respect I'd say the pressure gauge on the Rocket is a total waste of space and money, and that it just fulfills a role as eye candy on the admittedly beautiful chromed facade of the machine! It's my opinion, but personally I could care less that the pressure on the output stage of the pump is 9 bars when what I want to know is the pressure of the water being forced through the coffee puck (in addition to temperature and flow rate etc.)
I think also the realization of the importance of accurately monitoring, displaying & recording these key dynamic extraction parameters is what's driving the design philosophy of newer machines like the Descent and gadgets like the Smart Espresso Profiler.