Quickmill Andreja Premium complete shutdown

Equipment doesn't work? Troubleshooting? If you're handy, members can help.
ColinF

#1: Post by ColinF »

My Andreja Prem had been glitching for months. After sitting idle for a few hours it would become slow to pump or just breathe steam heavily out the group head but no pump no water.
If I switched it off overnight it would be fine by the morning.

It slowly got worse until a water leak from under the boiler onto electrical contacts finally shut things down.

I stripped it down, removed the boiler and pipes and descaled everything and reassembled and it worked well for about a week.
Then it started doing the no pump activation again after sitting idle for more than an hour.

And a week later it stopped completely.It just died.
Now there's no lights.No sounds,nothing.

There's 230V to the machine but nothing works

I've opened it up again to check for leaks or breakages I may have caused but it seems fine.No obvious leaks.Wiring contacts all cleaned tight and continuity checks along the wires are fine.
Earth/ground connections good

I'm trying to understand how to diagnose from here.
Is it the very expensive Gicar? the big relay on the side, the solenoid valve or the pressurestat..?

How do I proceed from here without handing it over to an espresso machine technician?

I like discovering how to keep things working and handing over to a shop for repairs is not only costly but nowhere near as interesting and satisfying.
I've spent hours reading the postings here and the volume of knowledge is huge but I can't find how to sort this particular situation

I'd be grateful for any pointers as to how to isolate the problem rather than just replace components until it works again.


Cheers, Colin.

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DaveC

#2: Post by DaveC »

ColinF wrote:1. My Andreja Prem had been glitching for months. After sitting idle for a few hours it would become slow to pump or just breathe steam heavily out the group head but no pump no water.

2. If I switched it off overnight it would be fine by the morning.

3. It slowly got worse until a water leak from under the boiler onto electrical contacts finally shut things down.

4. I stripped it down, removed the boiler and pipes and descaled everything and reassembled and it worked well for about a week.
Then it started doing the no pump activation again after sitting idle for more than an hour.

5. And a week later it stopped completely.It just died.
Now there's no lights.No sounds,nothing.

There's 230V to the machine but nothing works

I've opened it up again to check for leaks or breakages I may have caused but it seems fine.No obvious leaks.Wiring contacts all cleaned tight and continuity checks along the wires are fine.
Earth/ground connections good

I'm trying to understand how to diagnose from here.
6. Is it the very expensive Gicar? the big relay on the side, the solenoid valve or the pressurestat..?

How do I proceed from here without handing it over to an espresso machine technician?
I'd be grateful for any pointers as to how to isolate the problem rather than just replace components until it works again.


Cheers, Colin.
It could be a case of multiple problems obfuscating root causes

1. Sounds like the HX might be emptying if the pump runs and just steam comes out of the group, then eventually water. Unless you mean the pumps running slow...which I don't think you do. So a leak in the sealed brew circuit (group, expansion valve or 1 way valve).

2. Not sure because if you are saying that sometimes the pump doesn't run, but it does after you switch it back on the next morning...then Gicar Box could be faulty...but it doesn't sound like it.

3. Lack of maintenance, might or might not be related.

4. Lack of maintenance, scale can be the root cause of many problems, the fact it worked normally after descaling adds credence to it probably not being a Gicar box fault. Descaling may have stopped the leaking from the normally sealed HX circuit.

5. The big relay on the side simply switches the heating element on/off, rather than using the contacts on the pressurestat to do it directly, taking the amperage load of those smaller contacts. If it was the pressurestat or the relay, the pump would still work and lights come on etc.. If the Gicar box, has gone bad, then it's probably a new problem, although I'm still not convinced it's bad without further testing.

The tests do try are...check the low water system and float system, ensure the hall effect sensor wiring is ok and the float is switching that system. If you have to you can bridge the wires going to the hall sensor, or use your own magnet.

Check with a multimeter that you have mains voltage at the Gicar Box terminals

Giampiero

#3: Post by Giampiero »

ColinF wrote:My Andreja Prem had been glitching for months. After sitting idle for a few hours it would become slow to pump or just breathe steam heavily out the group head but no pump no water.
If I switched it off overnight it would be fine by the morning.
This could happen if the OPV valve seal is badly worn, and during the cooling period the HX it suck back water from the water reservoir through the OPV drain pipe, filling the HX itself.
All the others issue, related to the pump functionality, i will follow the suggestion of DaveC especially the check of the functionality of the water reservoir floating magnet and hall sensor and even the priming valve.

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cafeIKE
Supporter ★

#4: Post by cafeIKE »


ColinF (original poster)

#5: Post by ColinF (original poster) »

Thanks to each of you for replying.

Human error by this particular human!

Here's what happened.There were 2 issues that I was trying to answer.
The dead Andreja and the faulty Andreja.
While diligently cleaning contacts and checking wiring continuities I had inadvertently shifted 3 blue wire connections on the big relay on the side of the machine 1 tab over.
Result no power anywhere.

I had numbered each wire with marker wrongly then put them back on those wrong contact tabs!
My very cautious approach to 230V and a rudimentary meter didn't help, but a friend with more knowhow and a better meter found the problem following the advice here from DaveC.
As soon as I relocated wires the pump the lights and everything came alive.
It was the relay but it wasn't the relays fault.


While waiting for answers to the electrical problem and separate from it, I have also replaced the OPV valve, the group head valves and the pump.
For now I've bypassed the water level hall sensor.
The sensor had been a problem in the past that I've fixed with a new float and a new magnet and for now its better out of the equation.
Does the hall sensor itself go bad and need replacing or is it a bulletproof thing?

The other problem was that when the machine was hot and had not been activated for several hours, the pump would not start on lifting the brew lever and only steam would come out.
Boiler and brew pressures were both within spec and the pump pumped enough volume when it did work as in 1st thing in the morning.
Maybe the new OPV valve and new pump might sort this? I'll find out in the next 24 hours

The descaling was done because I had the machine apart to sort the water leak under the boiler and it seemed a good time to dunk the boiler and pipes in a container of scale remover.
The same problem before and after descale points to it being something other than scale.

cafeIke I had used search and read this site and elsewhere extensively for days before posting and had found the Anita wiring schematic helpful but was still lost for an answer to my particular question about dead Andreja, but thanks for your thoughts .

Giampero can you tell me more about the priming valve?...is that the solenoid that does the big click before the pump tops up the boiler when turning the machine on in the morning?

Thanks again, I'll keep you posted on progress.

Giampiero

#6: Post by Giampiero »

ColinF wrote: Giampero can you tell me more about the priming valve?...is that the solenoid that does the big click before the pump tops up the boiler when turning the machine on in the morning?

Thanks again, I'll keep you posted on progress.
I found this photo in another member post, and it's perfect for the purpose, easy peasy :)

ColinF (original poster)

#7: Post by ColinF (original poster) »

Thanks Giampero.
I'm pleased to report the machine is now running great.
Replacing the OPV and group head valves along with the pump seems to have sorted the original problem of steam but no water out the group.

Good to have it back :)