Hi all, first post here but been reading/stalking for a while !

I will try and keep it short not to bore everyone to death.

2 years ago, i decided to buy a Breville Oracle, found an "almost new " one from a local owner, which only have it for a few months and
his wife now wanted a fully auto , they never got to understand/make a great beverage with it.
Was a bit hesitating cause he did not have the original receipt etc..told me he just moved in a new house ..so i paid him visit only to found out
that everyhting in his story felt right , he already had a full auto Jura machine on the counter sitting just next to the unplugged Breville .

So took it home, started playing with it. Took me some time to find the right beans ( if you are in Canada you've got to try those out : Brûleries FARO Roasting Houses Authentic Italian Espresso which you can get on amazon.ca ..they been always perfectly fresh and taste is just out of this world ) ,
after trying something in the vicinity of 50 different beans . Even tried some " best of italia " 50$USD/lbs bag ...wasn't even good at all ..lol

So fast forward, been using those beans buying a fresh batch every 2 weeks, with very very very consistent results. Only had to vary the grind size
between mmm setting 13 and 20 , adjusting after every shot when necessary , to get a delightfull espresso output. I mainly drink cappuccinos with occasionals lattes and americanos .Always doubles shots ( would do quadruple shots if i could mouahaha )

About a year ago, started to get a buzzing sound from the machine, investigated and it turned out to the very very cheap main brew solenoid valves
that was already going dead . Found out a very solid replacement from a nice usa store " Stefano espresso care " .
"" Rancilio Silvia Sirai 3-Way Solenoid Valve 115V "" fist perfectly as a repalcement for the orignal can't recall the brand , solenoid valve Brevilles used on my machine .

Unfortunately, the steamer valves started doing the same ( same brand ) , i switched it with the hot water solenoid as i seldom use this one.
Now the steamer valve is starting to buzz a bit again, will need replacing those soon also i guess .. But that's not my main issue .

So about 6 months ago,
started to experience a drastic change in quantity of espresso that would come out in a shot. Started adjusting the grind size until i was not able
to produce any decent shots at all a few months ago , since i had to push it up to ~30 to even get enough water out to be able to make a drink out of it. The water pump ( brew pump ) also started to make some very weird noise at this point in time.
A month ago or so, the water pump was intermittently going off/on while brewing. How interesting !
So i opened up the machine, again, found out the model and bought a replacement off ebay. Replaced it ( pretty easy job ) and all of a sudden no moire weird noise ! BUT, the shot volume problem wasn't fixed at all !
Really thought the pump didn't have enough pressure anymore to get the correctly volume through.

Took the machine down, fiddled with the overpressure valve/regulator , volume meter, hoses ..tested all thati've could.
The took the brew valve off only to see a very very pitted and clogged valve port on the brew connector plate ...
OMFG ..that had been the main problem all along ...
Processed to clean that up, test everything out, made a high temp car engine silicone gasket to get everything to seat properly , new orings...
Can't believe BREVILLE used an ALUMINUM casting for the brew head connection plate, mated to a SS valve .

Also, while working on that machine, had to take out a few hoses here and there, and everytime you do so in a Breville,
be prepared for leaks ! Their O-rings seem to only be good when new and never touched ..if you remove them they will leak when you put them back in even if they look and feel fine. Probably dries a little too much and loose enough of their springness to be able to maintain proper seal.

So now after 2 weeks of fixing the machine , i have yet to produce 1 single good espresso shot.
Just cannot get it right at all.
The steamer is now not working properly, takes almost double time to froth milk ...don't care too much about that for now since i am trying to get back to where i was at on the pulling shot business, but the thought of opening up the machine to fix it AGAIN ! .... not very happy about that.

So lastly, sorry about the ESSAY i just typed , could anyone here please help me find out if there is still something wrong
with the machine on the shot side, so that i can get to enjoy a good cup of cafe as i've been in the last years ...

I miss my cappuccinos , so much ... almost depressing.

I'll try and share a few pics of what i went through in a later post !

Breville! not happy at all with you !

Your rather long story is the exact reason why nobody with enough knowledge would touch or recommend anything made by Breville. If you can fix it up - then fix it up and get rid of of. Otherwise - just sell it for parts and get yourself a real (European-made) machine.

Brevilles are perfect consumer products - like modern (especially - luxury) cars - they look good, they perform good under the warranty period - but then they just fall apart and aren't cost(time)-effective to keep repairing.

Sorry, wish I could give you more of a constructive comment...

It's alright. I fully understand that and i can relate through my experience.

What is very deceiving in that situation, is that while it was working well, the cafe i was able to achieve with it was on the Italian bar quality.
And i live quite far in the country with no way to get that experience without long travel time.
I 've even had many person telling me it was the best cafe they ever tasted.

Now i fully understand i could reproduce a similar setup with any combination of quality machines.
But to get that much of repeatability is very very difficult. This is what i believe is the best feature of the Breville, while it is working.

If i cannot get my "capp " quality back soon, i will definitely consider my options , but for now , i would very like to just get back to where i used to be.



I used to have start of drip at around ~9 seconds ( default pre-inf options of mm 7sec and 60% power i believe )
which i just can't seem to get anymore .... so now i usually get the first drops at around 12 seconds and it starts very similarly to before as far as texture , but it gets kinda runny/watery after 20 seconds; whereas i used to have that slow oily consistent drip all through the extraction before.

The result is too watery, too little taste,too little crema and no deep body.

I've tried playing with grind size quite a bit and i can't get it solely using that, as i did before.

If i increase griding size i get too much water and flow , and if i get it down i get well not enough and way to long infusion to get something that taste good .

The only thing that comes to mind if i try to see it logically , would be that there isn't enough pressure.
I've got no way ( no gauge ) to test that on that machine, ridiculously .

any tips for more testing ?

If I was in your situation - I'd probably gut the machine and re-assemble everything back while revising (and bench-testing when possible) every single part.

Otherwise, from what you're describing I'd be tempted to verify the pressure and temperature at the portafilter... or call a defeat and bring it to a professional service - got any around?

You haven't said about the maintenance while you owned the machine - how rigorous were you?

B.t.w. not sure about using engine silicone for the water which you drink - in hardware stores they have a sealer for threaded pipe connections - it's a food grade stuff which I apply when teflon tape isn't enough.

I have no service center near, and i like fixing stuff so i'd prefer to try things than pay 500$ someone who's probably going to random replace things.

Is there anyway to test pressure on those machine ? i don't understand why there is no pressure sensor
with a way to check it out digitally ...

Bah the difference between food grade stuff an non food grade stuff is often only the price :p
I used a silicone that uses acetic acid as evap and it really doesn't touch anything but rather seals the behind the regular silicone oring
i am pretty sure i limited the drinking water exposition/contact to it as much as possible.

Maintenance ...
well i did de-scale twice ..the first time took 1 week as some might be aware there is a stupid bug with the Breville DB and Oracle
where the de-scaling process never really stopped ..learned the hard way.
2nd time i did the de-scaling myself not relying on the software for it.

Got normal amount of scale out .nothing out of the ordinary i'd say,
but both times it was due to do. Surface extremely thing type of scale in both boilers.

I do backflush a lot, clean the grinding chute between been bags and the portafilter every time i use it.
Cleaned the brew head a few times removing the screen but to be frank, there isn't much to clean on that machine in there.

Just did a shot using much lower grinding size( 10 ) i normaly use and it seems better. It's not on the same level as used to be,
but better than earlier shots and was almost perfect in timing and volume .

Wonder if i'm having a grinder issue to add to everything else, some users did mention a burr assembly seating problem ...but that would
result in the reverse of what i am experiencing though ..

The Breville Oracle and Dual Boiler are giant teases. In theory they are the perfect home barista machine. They literally do everything you ask for. The reality is that for many people, the experience after several years is exactly what you are experiencing. I believe that when you do contact their customer support, many have had good luck getting the machine repaired or even replaced to a new model (some dual boiler 900 user received a 920 in return).

I have been strongly considering selling my German/Italian Pro 500 and getting a BDB for the temperature stability and better preinfusion capabilities. But this post (and others I've read on here) remind me why I went German/Italian in the first place. It's sad, for example, that a user descalable dual boiler glitches the way it does and makes the machine useless for a few weeks until it resets.

I wish Breville would take their technology, increase the price $500 or so, and upgrade the quality of parts and have all critical parts on their website for users to repair themselves. They are very active in SCAA and Barista gatherings because they want to be seen not only as a BBB appliance but as a true prosumer contender. They have all the desirable prosumer features in their machines, just not the long standing build quality. If they made a higher end BDB in the $2-2.5k range with real parts availability then I would purchase it.

I found out buying a Breville is like buying a car with no available parts.... can't wait until I can buy something better and repairable

Randy

BaristaBob wrote:Jay,

Though I agree with everything you said in principle, I think you are being too hard on the BDB. Does anyone know the rate of failure on the 900XL and 920XL machines? I mean really know?

That's a fair rebuttal and I am basing it off threads on HB which have given me pause. There are many like yourself and Peter who praise the machine and you take care of yours. This thread plus the one on the leaky boiler put the breaks on me buying a BDB. I guess I just wish parts were more ubiquitous.

For every person who reports trouble with a Breville machine, I wonder how many people are happily using theirs without issues?

Serious question.

Edit: Oops, I posted this before I read Barista Bob's post. Would also love to see the actual data.