Faema E61 Legend Scale - Page 2

Equipment doesn't work? Troubleshooting? If you're handy, members can help.
coffeehit78

#11: Post by coffeehit78 »

Thanks for the replies guys on solutions. I'm a bit confused what to use now. I think my easiest bet is white vinegar or citric acid as not sure how available in the UK the others are? I have food grade citric acid powder. Does this work by mixing with water or do I need a liquid solution?

I was hoping I wouldn't have to take it apart as obviously no experience or reference online how to do so. Any help in this route would be great.

Also as I'm new to the workings of the pump system of espresso machines, if I was to pump water into the boiler with acid would I need a flojet or can the internal rotary pump pull enough water and acid solution from a vessel into the boiler via the hose?

Cheers,
Steve

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Jake_G
Team HB

#12: Post by Jake_G »

coffeehit78 wrote: Thanks for the replies guys on solutions. I'm a bit confused what to use now. I think my easiest bet is white vinegar or citric acid as not sure how available in the UK the others are? I have food grade citric acid powder. Does this work by mixing with water or do I need a liquid solution?
The powder you have will work fine. I'm no expert on the ratios for descale solutions, I'll leave that for someone with more credentials to give advice. I will say that I will always defer any advice that I hand out to Paul Pratt. He does this professionally and there is arguably no one in the known universe that does a better or more complete job restoring classic espresso machines than he, so when Paul chimes in, I tend to listen.
coffeehit78 wrote: I was hoping I wouldn't have to take it apart as obviously no experience or reference online how to do so. Any help in this route would be great.
These machines are pretty basic. If you do tear it down, take photos (lots of them) and post your progress here. We're all a bunch of weirdos at heart and will live vicariously through your efforts and help you get it back to working order. :wink:
coffeehit78 wrote: Also as I'm new to the workings of the pump system of espresso machines, if I was to pump water into the boiler with acid would I need a flojet or can the internal rotary pump pull enough water and acid solution from a vessel into the boiler via the hose?
You may have to pour some water into the inlet hose to get the pump primed but yes, it should have no problem pulling the citric acid solution from a bucket with the pump. If your pump is outboarded, put the pump as low as possible and place the bucket a little bit above the pump to help give it some head pressure, and dont let the suction hose suck air...

The general process for an in-chassis descale is to start with a dry machine, suck up the citric acid, power the machine on, let it heat up and stay hot for a while, then power it off and open the hot water tap to let the steam pressure in the boiler push the descale solution out the spout. Do this a few times and at some point, peer into the boiler to assess your progress. Run some through the groups, as well.

When you're happy with the results, do the same thing but with pure water MANY times until the water coming out the spout and groups is clear and tastes good.

All that said, Paul knows his stuff and knows the risks of trying an in-chassis descale with a machine in your condition. There is a possibility that bits of scale debris will find themselves lodged within the various valves and seals within your machine necessitating a tear down to identify where the problem is. Doing a full and methodical teardown right now saves you this probable heartache. If you get lucky and all is well, then your time-ahead trying the in-chassis approach. But understand the risks...


Cheers!


- Jake

coffeehit78

#13: Post by coffeehit78 »

Hey Jake,

Very thorough advice and it feels very comforting with the support provided here. I did like the idea of taking it apart as you get to know your tools of the trade it's just the fear of doing something wrong. I am a 3 plus years experienced speciality coffee barista so getting to know even the smallest amount on the other side puts me ahead of the game ;)

Gonna have to have a look at this later next week as I have to go away for a few days but please any advice from all would be great in setting things in motion for me.

Thanks so much guys!

Cheers,
Steve

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Paul_Pratt

#14: Post by Paul_Pratt »

Steve you can find the descaler here:

https://espresso-solutions.co.uk/clean- ... owder-1kg/

coffeehit78

#15: Post by coffeehit78 »

Thanks Paul!

Have you used this one before? Recommend over Citric?

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Paul_Pratt

#16: Post by Paul_Pratt » replying to coffeehit78 »

I use it all the time, sulfamic based I believe. Like I said before I alternate between citric and that as I find scale reacts differently. In your case I would go with that commercial descaler - much quicker than citric.

coffeehit78

#17: Post by coffeehit78 »

Awesome man! I'll get it ordered. Cheers!

coffeehit78

#18: Post by coffeehit78 »

Paul. Got the descaler.

What ratio do you recommend and how long do you suggest I leave in the boiler for?

Cheers,
Steve

coffeehit78

#19: Post by coffeehit78 »

It's says 5-20% on label but cant think how to work that out dry weight to water. Boiler is 11L. It also says Max temp 50C so would obviously not take the machine up to full temp?

coffeehit78

#20: Post by coffeehit78 »

Just thinking is it 20% weight of water? for example the boiler is 11L = 11,000G - 9% = 990G (Descaler comes in 1KG so 1 tub would do just over 9%).