ECM Synchronika pump ramp up noise normal?

Equipment doesn't work? Troubleshooting? If you're handy, members can help.

#1: Post by Mggray87 »

Just wondering and I don't remember as I've had the machine for like 3 years now. Is it normal for ecm synch to be kinda loud when initially lifting the brew handle. It sounds like a loud rattle my machine is plumbed in currently showing 2 bar maybe 2.5 bar sometimes. I took off panels and top panel and it's the pump that is loud. No rattling of any panels. I also added the flow control maybe over a year ago. If I turn it a 1/4 turn. It is pretty quiet not much rattle and loudness but 1/2 turn or more it's loud. Also measuring my g/s. Max turn 1.5 turns I'm only getting 7g/s. Flow. Isn't standard synch before I added this like 11g/s flow?

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#2: Post by Nunas »

When you pull into a blind basket, such as for back flushing, how many bars do you get on your brew pressure gauge? On the front panel, what's the pump pressure reading?

Mggray87 (original poster)

#3: Post by Mggray87 (original poster) » replying to Nunas »

What setting. 1 full turn or a half turn? I'll do it now with a blind basket just give me a specific setting

Mggray87 (original poster)

#4: Post by Mggray87 (original poster) »

I just did a blind basket like I'm cleaning and with a 1/4 turn from off, 1/2 turn and 1 full turn I'm getting the same if I leave it on for like 20 seconds. They all go to 10 bar on the ecm gauge and on the flow gauge

Although I don't think this is the cause. But watching this My 10 bar seems way high compared to what he says they send it at 8 to 8.5. I guess I should adjust mine to match what it should be with blind basket

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#5: Post by Nunas »

Mggray87 wrote:What setting. 1 full turn or a half turn? I'll do it now with a blind basket just give me a specific setting
It does not matter where the FCD is set when doing a blind basket test. The pressure will stabilize to the pump bypass setting in short order. Incidentally, the equivalent to the stock mushroom is about 1.25 turns open on my Synchronika. Ten bar isn't considered high, even on a stock Synchronika. Nominally, nine bar is considered "normal". I watched the video you referenced; I've no idea why they set their machines to 8.5 bar, especially with a machine equipped with flow control. The brew head pressure should be more or less the same, unless you let it run for quite a while, in which case the pressure will rise. I've always wondered why it does this, and was happy to get an explanation from the video, although I'm not sure if I totally understand it.

In any case, the reason I asked you to do these tests was to see if your pump is operating normally, which it seems to be doing.

As for the noise, on the pump side of the machine, there's a condenser, some wires and a capillary tube. On my machine, these were vibrating, until is moved them a bit. Sorry, but if it isn't that, I've no idea why your machine is making a lot of noise. Any chance you could pull a shot or two and record the sound? Maybe someone else has run into the same thing.


#6: Post by JRising »

If there's any sort of restriction on the inlet side of the pump, you have to make sure it's not too restrictive. It has to easily pass as much water as the pump is able to move. The pump WILL move as much as it is able to pass through the downstream restrictors, with the flow control wide open and no coffee in the way, that's a good percentage of the pump's maximum flow 50gph or about 3 litres/minute. If anything in the inlet restricts that flow the pump will put more water out than it can take in and the little pockets of vacuum flowing through the pump make a lot of noise (and will damage the pump in time). If you know the noise, you'll recognize it vs. vibrating panels etc.

What is your water treatment set-up? Is the regulator and gauge before or after the softener? If after, how low does the gauge go when the pump is making the noise?

Mggray87 (original poster)

#7: Post by Mggray87 (original poster) » replying to JRising »

I just took my RO unit 4g tank and ran it to the machine. So that RO water 4 gallon tank is running it with 3/8 line. I don't know what the pressure is but the synch is showing 2 bar just sitting there. Even slightly over 2 bar.

Mggray87 (original poster)

#8: Post by Mggray87 (original poster) »

Maybe run it from the built in water tank and see if it changes?

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#9: Post by Nunas »

Yes! I was just typing that suggestion, you must be psychic :lol: . The pressure from your RO is just about right for a plumbed in machine. Concerning your low flow of 7 gm/s when testing water debit, switching back to using the reservoir to see if the noise goes away is a good test. If it does, then John may have hit the nail on the head with his comment about restriction at the inlet causing cavitation. Rotary pumps in espresso machines are primarily made to push, not pull water.

Mggray87 (original poster)

#10: Post by Mggray87 (original poster) »

I just ran the tank mode. Now it's quiet as heck. Not used to that. And ran the flow control on full turn it's 10.95g/s and 1.25 turns was 12.7. So now I'm actually getting flow different when turning it. I put the flow back to 10 bar because I read when doing blind filter 10bar will be 9 bar during coffee extraction. I'll test that out shortly. So I guess my ro tank can't push enough water. So not sure how to run ro water to this machine now.