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decent_espresso (original poster)
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#1271: Post by decent_espresso (original poster) »




Dewrinkling clothes with your steam wand

Bugs had the crazy idea of using the steam wand on our espresso machine to dewrinkle clothes, just like a professional laundry might do with specialized equipment.

We were shocked! shocked! shocked! at how well it worked.

We tried several flow rates, and 0.8ml/s was the best mix of speed and dryness. 0.4ml/s was quite slow, and 1.6ml/s made wet spots.

We'll be editing the live video that we shot today, and posting it soon.

In the meantime, if you own an espresso machine, give it a try!

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#1272: Post by decent_espresso (original poster) »

TundraRunner wrote:I have a DE1 Pro...I also have narrowed my tastes where I'm mostly/always drinking medium to medium-dark roasts, "chocolate plus" types, and have very little interest experimenting with light roasts anymore.
We've been working on improving the kinds of espresso that the Decent makes with medium-to-dark roasted beans. Our focus has indeed been on the light roasts as that's been (what we think) something that could be improved, but most people (including me) are in the medium-or-darker world.

In 2023, we'll have a few things coming out specifically for the darker roast crowd:
- new inner block parts that reduce headspace (as you've done) but also reduce "donut extraction", producing higher EY% and thicker shots
- 3 new portafilter baskets, with a "waisted" design, that product much more "classic" espresso, with thicker body, and less channeling.
- a new profile, using low temperatures and profiling (extracting from 80ºC and going down to 72ºC !) that makes the best espresso I've tasted with medium dark roasted beans. This is not an espresso for milking, it's a sipping "neat" dark roast espresso.

This live taping discusses the new baskets and the new profile:
And this live taping is about the new inner group head parts:
Both videos are being edited (their too lengthy and verbose at the moment) and will be released once that's done. I'm providing you with the live versions in case you want to get a preview of what we're doing.

turnlive

#1273: Post by turnlive »

Hi John,

So when I install the new inner block kit on my current v1.43 DE1 once available, then I'll get the standard E61 head space without any other space kit needed, is that a correct understanding?

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#1274: Post by decent_espresso (original poster) »

turnlive wrote:when I install the new inner block kit on my current v1.43 DE1 once available, then I'll get the standard E61 head space without any other space kit needed, is that a correct understanding?
Exactly

jasongcasale

#1275: Post by jasongcasale »

great job on explaining why you needed new materials for the water dispersion parts.
I really appreciate this so much.
My question is about the internal group head itself that these parts connect to.
I know it is still brass.
When will it be switched out for stainless steel and what is the rev number when this will happen with targeted date.
Thanks your fan Jason Casale.

P.S. I love shots with lots of body from Espresso Vivace in Seattle.
I love traditional italian blends trending toward the medium dark range as well.
I love to put 25 grams in a 21 gram basket with 1:1 shot ratio.
What baskets would you recommend for these.

caeffe

#1276: Post by caeffe »

decent_espresso wrote:We've been working on improving the kinds of espresso that the Decent makes with medium-to-dark roasted beans. Our focus has indeed been on the light roasts as that's been (what we think) something that could be improved, but most people (including me) are in the medium-or-darker world.

In 2023, we'll have a few things coming out specifically for the darker roast crowd:
......
- 3 new portafilter baskets, with a "waisted" design, that product much more "classic" espresso, with thicker body, and less channeling.
......
I recall a post by you here previously addressing the "waisted" baskets and that your team was evaluating them.
Would love to hear more and also if you can maybe share what these 3 new baskets look like profile wise. Seems that your teams findings are validating the classic Italian espresso recipe of 14g in; normale, ristretto, lungo. One of the early posts, threads on here i can recall was that 14g dose was the norm - now we hear 18g, sometimes 21g.

"Mind the Gap" :)
I've always wondered about the relationship of dose, basket, headspace (aka grouphead geometry) and its impact on the puck. I'm sometimes befuddled or questioned the dose vs ratio recipe - roasters and folks here will talk about 18g in 36g out (1:2 or 2:1?) but somehow skip out on discussing the basket and how much headspace it has. There could probably be a whole separate thread on specifying dose - with machine geometry, basket size, headspace, coffee mass/height and I'd certainly like to hear more folks thoughts on this.

I have an old Gaggia classic "14g" basket which compared to the Decent basket is tapered down. I also have a couple of these: https://www.espressoparts.com/products/ ... asket-14gr - which are also tapered down. I've used them both but mostly the ridgeless version (I like to load 2-3 baskets ahead of time and just pop them in and out of the portafilter; no spring) In practice I can load it to 18g. It does require grind adjustment (coarser); my take is due to the lower hole density. Is it similar to this but optimized for the Decent basket family hence minimal to no grind adjustment as one adjusts dose or rather puck height to match basket size?
LMWDP #162

GDK

#1277: Post by GDK »

caeffe wrote: "Mind the Gap" :)
I've always wondered about the relationship of dose, basket, headspace (aka grouphead geometry) and its impact on the puck. I'm sometimes befuddled or questioned the dose vs ratio recipe - roasters and folks here will talk about 18g in 36g out (1:2 or 2:1?) but somehow skip out on discussing the basket and how much headspace it has. There could probably be a whole separate thread on specifying dose - with machine geometry, basket size, headspace, coffee mass/height and I'd certainly like to hear more folks thoughts on this.
I think you nailed it. More modern is not necessarily better. There should be no gain in taste by going from say 14-16g to 18-21g, IMHO, if the headspace is appropriate in either case. Baskets/machines that have greater space will certainly benefit taste-wise from higher doses. With very light roasts and longer rations, higher doses may work well but it is practically a step towards the brewed coffee realm.

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#1278: Post by decent_espresso (original poster) »

jasongcasale wrote:My question is about the internal group head itself that these parts connect to.
I know it is still brass.When will it be switched out for stainless steel and what is the rev number when this will happen with targeted date..
As of v1.45 (coming in July 2023), in the group we'll have a top part that is brass, and the two parts below it will be PPS plastic.




As of v1.46 (coming in July 2024), the top part of the group will be stainless.The casting process can take a long time to get right, and supply chains are really slow currently, to make new designs.

When we do go stainless for the top of the group head, we'll also have a different kind of heater on it, moving off the cartridge heater that we use for the brass parts, to a flat "thick film" heater.



This lets us remove a lot of metal off the group, which we need to do in order to continue to have a fast warm up time. Stainless is much less heat conductive than brass, so we needed to find a way to remove mass in order to still heat in 4.5 minutes.

The main advantage of going from brass to stainless for us is one of cost. CNCed brass is very expensive to make with the precision we need. Cast stainless, then drilling out the precision areas, is much less expensive. The removal of worrying about lead is a nicety too, but we source our brass well and for the past several years the SGS tests have had "no detectable lead".










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#1279: Post by decent_espresso (original poster) »

caeffe wrote:I recall a post by you here previously addressing the "waisted" baskets and that your team was evaluating them.
Would love to hear more and also if you can maybe share what these 3 new baskets look like profile wise. Seems that your teams findings are validating the classic Italian espresso recipe of 14g in; normale, ristretto, lungo. One of the early posts, threads on here i can recall was that 14g dose was the norm - now we hear 18g, sometimes 21g.
The new "waisted" baskets Decent is coming out with are best at doses of 14g, 14g and 12g. Yes, two baskets optimized for the same 14g dose :)

The reason is that the two baskets are different levels of taper, and the greater taper gives more body, simplicity (not necessarily a bad thing) in taste, and greater ease of no-channel extraction.

Here are drawings for all 3 of them.







Here is a photo of the 12g basket. We laser etch the side and bottom.






These will be the SKUs and names. Each basket will cost USD$25. I'm not yet exactly sure when we'll have these in stock, but possible in the next few weeks. I'll announce when they are.

Slightly waisted Portafilter Basket (14g)
DE-BASKET14V1_SW-30068

Very waisted Portafilter Basket (14g)
DE-BASKET14V1_VW-30069

Extremely waisted Portafilter Basket (12g)
DE-BASKET12V1_EW-30070

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#1280: Post by decent_espresso (original poster) »

jasongcasale wrote:I love traditional italian blends trending toward the medium dark range as well.
I love to put 25 grams in a 21 gram basket with 1:1 shot ratio.
What baskets would you recommend for these.
The best two classic espressos I've had (medium dark roast) were Paul's with our current 15g basket, and a 14g dose with the "slightly waisted" basket, coming soon. He's using a 82C->72C temperature profile and something similar to the "default" pressure profile (9 bar to 6). That "all about body" video shows more about that.

I haven't done doses like you're suggesting for maybe 5 years, when I was then trying to make "Lavazza Gold" and similar beans (from an Italian deli) work. Their lack of freshness, I think, is what required me to overdose like that, which was effective at suppressing the stale off flavors that otherwise appeared.

But yes, with roasted-a-year-ago high end mass-market Italian beans, I would dose 25g in a 22g basket, go with 1:1.2 ratio, and the result was nice.

-john