User Experience with the Argos lever espresso machine - Page 10

#91: Post by **Lizzoob** » September 9th, 2023, 3:25 pm

jevenator wrote: "Direct config makes it a lot easier to pull shots at least on first impressions."

Can you please say more about this? "Easier" as in amount of arm strength required, or...? And is it necessary to buy the analog gauge if one chooses direct configuration?

Thanks!

#92: Post by **bgn** » September 9th, 2023, 4:22 pm

I don't have my Argos yet, but have used a spring lever for many years.
With spring configuration the handle rests at it's highest position. If you took the spring out then the handle will rest at its lowest position. With spring configuration there is no arm force used except to cock the spring. The spring does all the work of applying the pressure. With the direct configuration, no spring, it would be easier to compensate on the fly for the dose and tamp because you can vary the pressure with your arm. With the spring, once you let go of the handle it is what it is.

#93: Post by **Lizzoob** » September 9th, 2023, 4:33 pm

Thanks @bgn! So "With spring configuration there is no arm force used except to cock the spring. The spring does all the work of applying the pressure. With the direct configuration, no spring..." So how much arm force does it take to pull the lever with direct configuration? I am a 70+ woman--I can lift 12 lb weights but I would hate starting my morning with what might feel like a workout.

#94: Post by **Jeff** » September 9th, 2023, 4:38 pm

If you haven't used a manual lever before, the pressure gauge may help in learning what a reasonable pressure is for extraction. There's a lot of information available without a gauge from how hard the lever is resisting you pressing down and what the flow looks like. At $50 is isn't "cheap" but it isn't very expensive either. If it helps you get better shots from a few bags of coffee, it might have justified its cost. There are dozens of opinions on this in the Robot thread, a manual lever machine that also has an optional gauge. TL;DR -- no agreement. (It's more of a curiosity if you're using it as a spring lever, as the pressure comes from the spring and is what it is.)

September 9th, 2023, 6:41 pm

Lizzoob wrote:Thanks @bgn! So "With spring configuration there is no arm force used except to cock the spring. The spring does all the work of applying the pressure. With the direct configuration, no spring..." So how much arm force does it take to pull the lever with direct configuration? I am a 70+ woman--I can lift 12 lb weights but I would hate starting my morning with what might feel like a workout.

Cocking the spring: I'm gonna say I saw somewhere someone (maybe even Ross Ainsworth). . . .please don't hold me to this all disclaimers apply. . .17lbs.
Direct configuration: on the Cafelat Robot I think it is around 35 lbs to generate 8 bar (again all disclaimers apply.) It might be easier on the Argos. Anyhow my DW can manage the Robot and pride won't let her put it on a lower surface (she's short.)

At any rate you could wait until there is more info out as more people get their machines. I wonder what the estimate for delivery would be were someone to place an order today?

Gauge: I'm from the school of 'this is useful data.'

#96: Post by **Lizzoob** » September 9th, 2023, 7:44 pm

Thanks!

#97: Post by **Lizzoob** » September 9th, 2023, 8:09 pm

Thank you!

#98: Post by **JonF** » September 10th, 2023, 3:04 pm

This has been a fun thread. I am really close to ordering one myself. About 20 years ago I had a Baby Lusso lever. As a complete rookie, I could not get used to it--I did not play with pressure changes, and thus it brewed really hot.

Now I know a little more, and I have another machine handy to do milk drinks when desired or a morning Americano. So this looks like it would be a lot of fun. Of course it helps that it is REALLY pretty.

I'm interested to see if owners prefer Direct or Spring mode? I know you can change if desired. Off hand, I think I would like Direct more, but I've never had a Spring machine before. Any thoughts would be welcome.

#99: Post by **Maak** » September 16th, 2023, 7:41 am

Lizzoob wrote: I like to drink very long espressos--60ml. Ross said this can be accomplished as follows: "you can do what is called a fellini which is very common in lever machines where you pull the lever down again halfway through the shot to refill the group and get a higher yield. With our air bleed valve in the piston, the coffee puck will not be disturbed during the additional pull." Have you (or anyone else reading this) tried this?

I believe you will get a better result adding hot water to a shorter pull. Espressing that large a yield will get the worst flavour from the coffee.

#100: Post by **Lizzoob** » September 16th, 2023, 7:48 am

<<I believe you will get a better result adding hot water to a shorter pull. Espressing that large a yield will get the worst flavour from the coffee.>>

I currently drink 60 mL pulls using my Gaggia Classic pro, and I've never felt the flavor was off, or even significantly different from when I make a shorter pull. Is there any reason to think it would be different using a lever machine? Just to experiment, this morning I am going to make a 45 mL pull and add 50 mL of boiling water. It does not sound appealing though!