Profitec Pro 800 plumbing/PID issue - Page 2

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HB
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#11: Post by HB »

blackrobe1540 wrote:At that point I hear an awful buzzing sound (i assume it's a pump?). The boiler refills and the Orange light and PID come back on.
That awful sound is probably the vibratory pump (part #4) trying to pull water but the outgoing valve is closed (part #22), so it whines until the boiler is refilled by the plumbed-in water inlet (part #19).

The cutoff switch behind the driptray should disable the pump in the "1" position. If that's not working and you're comfortable removing the case, you could try removing the power connections to the pump (reminder: let the machine cool down and unplug it before removing the case). That will [obviously] prevent the onboard pump from running. If that solves the problem, then you know that the pump disable switch is the cause.


The pump is part #4 above; it has two spade connections for power.
Dan Kehn

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#12: Post by blackrobe1540 »

Hi Dan. I'll give that a try this evening and report back :-)
John in Chicago
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#13: Post by blackrobe1540 »

So...

I received a message from WLL after several back and forths - this was confirmed by their head of prosumer tech support:
Apparently the Pro 800 does not run silently. When plumbed, the pump does not activate as we know - as that's the main source of noise in most espresso machines. When plumbed and the boiler needs to be filled the solenoid turns on/off while the boiler fills. It is normal for this to make what I call a buzzing sound - and normal that the Orange light turns off and the PID goes dark.
It's interesting how many references online there are to "silent operation" of the Pro 800. It's only Clive Coffee that describes the machine as "nearly silent."
John in Chicago
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#14: Post by SoCalSeaBreeze »

The video reset of PID - results on Profitec Pro 800
1.) it resets the temperature from C to F temperature - USA settings that we use
2.) the factory setting the Profitec Pro 800 PID came set too low so this:
a.) Reset and raised the temp by about 50 degrees F
b.) Which Increased the steam pressure - it was noticeable on the gauge which was near zero to .25 (white gauge area) and moved it near 1 the
beginning of the green color indicating it was in correct pressure "range area" of the the gauge.
c.) Noticed a huge difference in the steam wand power for steaming milk
3.) it also solved the tank refilling issues and and now works properly because sometimes wouldn't fill. I only hear the quiet rotary pump kick in
when the boilers are are filling from the water tank - I am not plumbed in at this time

blackrobe1540
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#15: Post by blackrobe1540 »

Has anyone else plumbed in their Pro 800? I'd love to hear what it sounds like when it fills...
John in Chicago
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#16: Post by Graymatters »

I'm waiting on my filtering system (which was ordered a week ago and still hasn't shipped :roll: ) - hopefully, I'll be able to get it installed before going out of town in a couple of weeks.
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#17: Post by blackrobe1540 »

Has anyone had success getting into contact with Profitec? I know they want service issues to go through their retailers -- but I want a second opinion on what Whole Latte Love has told me is normal operation for the Pro 800. I can't believe that Profitec built a machine that is louder and more annoying sounding plumbed than when using the reservoir.
John in Chicago
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#18: Post by HB »

blackrobe1540 wrote:Has anyone else plumbed in their Pro 800? I'd love to hear what it sounds like when it fills...
Here you go:
It's not silent, but it's definitely quieter than the vibratory pump. I believe the sound is from the water rushing through a vary narrow inlet. I tried cutting off the water supply to check if the noise was a "buzzing" solenoid as suggested in this thread; the noise immediately stopped.

Note that the owner's manual calls out operational pressure of 2-3 bar:
The boiler is filled by the line pressure, if you are using the Pro800 with a fixed water connection. The pump is not activated when using a fixed water connection. Make sure that the fixed water connection of the machine is hooked up to a potable water supply with an operational pressure of 2 to 3 bars. Please note that the pressure of the water supply may not always be consistent. As soon as 3 bars of pressure are occasionally exceeded, install a pressure reducer.
That's about ~40 PSI max, which is lower than most home water pressure of 50-55 PSI. The Pro 800 in the video above is on our third floor, so the effective line pressure is ~2.5 bar.
Dan Kehn

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#19: Post by blackrobe1540 »

Dan,

Excellent. Thanks for the video. Mine sounds exactly the same. So, I guess that is how is meant to be. I'll use this as an opportunity to put my doubts to rest.

My pressure is good too - between 2-3 bars consistently.

Thanks again!

John
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#20: Post by Driver9 »

I just plumbed in my Pro 800 last week for the first time, and I too was surprised about how much noise it made while re-filling the boiler. It sounded just like Dan's machine in his video... a buzzing sound not unlike the vibration pump, only lower in volume. At first I thought it was due to a faulty solenoid. I opened up the machine and was able to confirm that the sound was in fact coming directly from the solenoid. After a little research and troubleshooting (I did the same off-on-off-on flow test that Dan mentions) I concluded that the water flow is somehow causing the solenoid to produce the noise.

I am using a BWT Inline Pressure Reducer and had the static pressure set to 2.5 bar (flow pressure of about 2.1 bar). I tried slowly reducing the pressure (while water was flowing) and found that the noise reduced as well. I found the sweet spot to be a static pressure of 2 bar (flow pressure of about 1.6 bar). At that setting the noise is significantly reduced and the annoying buzzing is completely gone, while the flow rate is still sufficient. I have not timed it, but it does not take noticeably longer to re-fill the boiler.

So if that solenoid noise is bothering you and you are using a pressure reducer, set the static (no flow) pressure to 2 bar, which will be about 1.6 bar when the solenoid is open and the boiler is re-filling, and see if you get the same result that I did... very little noise and no buzzing.


** While I had my machine opened I did notice that the label on the solenoid reads "0 - 14,0 bar AC". I assume that means the solenoid is rated for use with water pressure of 0 to 14 bar. Makes me wonder if Profitec's recommendation of 2-3 bar is based on the noise factor alone.

Billy