Hi all,

So I recently ventured into the lever world with my first manual lever of a 1st gen La Pavoni ECP version 1.6 with the massimo Minimo switch. I have had some wonderful shots off the machine and have been really enjoying the fun one can have with all that control. Needless to say the lever bug has bitten me hard and I find myself wanting to add a spring lever to my bench. I have been reading a lot on here about spring levers and realize that there are a ton of choices and most of which one really can't go wrong as they all seem to be capable of great espresso.
The PV Lusso has been of interest to me due to its temp stability, great steaming and ability to pull shot after shot. Warm up times are not a concern for me as I can easily hook a timer up to whatever machine I get. My question is in regards to the manufacturing issues people describe when concerning the PV Lusso. It seems as though for a while the company was cutting corners and putting a machine out that was having a lot of hiccups. Have these issues been somewhat resolved as of late? Some of the posts I have read have been a bit dated and wonder if the new PV Lusso are different/better machine that are better built with less issues? After graduation out of PT school here in the next couple years I will be looking at celebrating with a nice prosumer to even commercial type lever machine but that is ways off still.

Thanks


...split follow-on discussion to Ponte Vecchio Lusso two group arrived by moderator...[/i]

Best bet is to ask Jim at 1st Line espresso. He sells PV plus a lot of other brands, and can give you an honest appraisal. PV has tended to get a bad rap here on HB lately, although there seem to be plenty of satisfied owners.

PC

Last I had heard Ponte Vecchio was aware of concerns about their build quality and they claimed they had taken steps to correct it.

Where I heard this I do not remember, I think on another thread here.

If you don't need giant sized boiler, you might take a look at this machine. https://www.coffeegeek.com/forums/membe ... ell/708546 Same grouphead as PV and they have very good quality, but I would find out which year/version it is though, because piston seals can be hard to find for some of the older ones.

Roger, thanks guys I wrote an email to 1st line. We will see what they say!

Phone them. They're very responsive.

Ok, just called and spoke with 1st-line for quite awhile. 1st off I just want to say they were awesome!!! As far as the Lusso is concerned it sounds like a lot of the issues that people have described with this machine have been recognized and fixed. The factory has actually changed suppliers all together, which is great to hear. The shipping has also been improved to better protect these machines in transit which I guess was another reason leading to many of the issues complained about. With the improvements though comes a little higher price tag now days although I still feel that $1,000 for a capable spring lever is a fair price. Also, 1st line pretty much has every part you could need, should any issues arise, something like 4 pages worth on their website just for their Vecchio machines. I guess the support frame on these bad boys is just rock solid as well in case anyone was wondering! Think I will be a future Vecchio Lusso owner before to long.

That sounds encouraging. I try not to speak too warmly of the PV machines anymore because I don't want to give people bad advice. But the design itself, especially the Lusso, has a lot of advantages (and some disadvantages), so if you can get good support it might be worth a go. Many people would rather step up to a Strega or similar, but for me that is not an option due to cost and space constraints.

My experience from a Sama Lusso (the forerunner of PV). Note I also learned to use the PV group on the Export, so no learning curve there when I got the Lusso.

Pluses:
The Lusso does have great temperature stability and certainly a nice steel frame. It sits pretty firm on the counter and you can pull shots and steam simultaneously. The largest boiler and heaviest of the home levers. The group design is very forgiving for getting good extractions. With decent mechanical/electrical skills and some patience, maintenance and even complete rebuild is relatively simple. The machines will last a long time, provided they are mechanically-sound to start with. My Lusso is from the 70s or 80s and seems as solid as the day it was born.

Minuses:
The concern about quality control is the major hurdle. Group maintenance is a PIA, but improved now that the piston removal tool is available. General maintenance also requires basic mechanical skills because the steel case needs to be removed. Changing the pressure (temperature) also requires removing the case unless you drill a hole for screwdriver access. You can temperature surf to some degree without changing the Pstat by monitoring group temperature and doing warming flushes if needed. The small-diameter group size is the major factor affecting the espresso brewing (see below).

Do bear in mind that the piston diameter is small. While this is a plus for getting good even extractions, it makes a small volume of espresso per piston stroke (15 ml). The PV group shines at 15g:30ml ristretto shots using two pulls ,or 7g:15ml singles. My maximum shot volume is <45ml. The maximum basket capacity is 18-19g (which is where I usually am). If you are looking for 25g triples or traditional 60 ml doubles you probably want a larger-group machine.

Well the Lusso sounds right up my alley, even with my 58mm pump and rather modified gaggia I never pulled above 30-32ml. I have always enjoyed a ristretto style shot with all its thick syrupy glory. The pavoni has just made me appreciate the smaller volume shots that much more and with my addiction to everything coffee it helps on the health side of things as well. After reading Timo's impressions on the lusso and the conversations that developed because of his thread I feel the lusso will be a good addition to my counter top. A temp stable and capable spring lever what is not to love. With our first kid on the way having a machine to keep up with all the family that will be visiting will be nice! Honestly I love the way it looks too!