Primacog wrote:... and steams milk far better than my izzo did.

That's good to hear - must be a well matched steam tip and good hole config. Any idea of the steam boiler wattage? I too will be coming from a 5 L Izzo and was thinking the steaming is going to be a let down. But I also was disappointed with the Synchronika's 2 L steam boiler until I bought a tip with bigger holes.

The steaming power of the izzo for me was just way too powerful - in all the years I had it, I never really came to terms with its steaming power and always had difficulty controlling it. I probably should have found a different steam tip to solve the issue.

On the other hand I find the nurri steam wand to be plenty powerful enough and much more controllable and easier to produce the texture in the milk that I wanted without any need to modify anything.

The steam boiler is 1.8L in capacity. According to this Thai dealer, there is a 1000W heating element for it.

https://m.facebook.com/SalottoCoffee/ph ... 892945765/

Thanks - not the greatest at 1000W but maybe designed so brew, steam and heating cartridges could all be on together. It wasn't the case with the Synchronica - which had 1400W steam and 1000W brew, alternating heating (would have been nice to have a 15A (@ 230V) config though allowing simultaneous).

Fortunately my ceilings are white, because the standard 2 hole steam tip on the Izzo is too fierce for 200 mL milk. But it's good when steaming for two. For one, I swap to a 3 hole tip (0.7mm diameter holes instead of 1mm from memory) - with one blocked off, so half the 'power'. The slower, the easier, but I do like to get steaming started and done during the extraction.

jontyc wrote:Thanks - not the greatest at 1000W but maybe designed so brew, steam and heating cartridges could all be on together. It wasn't the case with the Synchronica - which had 1400W steam and 1000W brew, alternating heating (would have been nice to have a 15A (@ 230V) config though allowing simultaneous).

Fortunatey my ceilings are white, because the standard 2 hole steam tip on the Izzo is too fierce for 200 mL milk. But it's good when steaming for two. For one, I swap to a 3 hole tip (0.7mm diameter holes instead of 1mm from memory) - with one blocked off, so half the 'power'. The slower, the easier, but I do like to get steaming started and done during the extraction.

You are likely correct I suspect - on top of that it has to also cater to the US market as well and be able to function in their kitchens without any modified circuit.

I had my izzo for many years and at first missed using it a lot as i really liked it. But its new owner is really liking it and using it not only for home but for business so its appreciated and used properly, while the nurri has truly brought a new dimension where for the izzo it was either not possible or just difficuptlt, convoluted and troublesome to achieve. So it's all good...

bakafish wrote:I don't think they misunderstand this machine. Maybe there were some changes after they told to me. Actually the dealer is also tired of selling this machine and decided not to accept orders temporarily because of delay many times and without the details of improvements. Maybe they don't have the latest information. Antonio refused to comunicate with me about the issues of the machine. He asked me to contact the dealer instead, so I will not bother him again. If it is still one PID, I am not interested in the upgrade or patch either. I know the limit of one PID. The steam pressure drops quickly not only because of the PID, also the heater power and the diameter of the inner tube or the copper pipe between the boiler and the steam wand is bigger than other machines', such as Lelit Bianca, Expobar, and ECM. The bigger diameter of the inner tube and copper pipe is good for making really creamy and silky milk foam.

I re tested the steam wand again today after firing up the machine just to test it. I think it was shorter than 15 mins after switching on but the boiler had reached the set temp so I went for it. I found that the steam boiler lost 0.4 bar over 10 seconds so it was a lot more than I had thought previously when I had tested it. I will try again later today when I properly make coffee to see if that's the case.

(Edited to include the following section)

A few hours later I switched on the machine again and tested it over 5 times of more thna 10 second bursts of steam. The manometer showed the pressure of the steam boiler droppinng by between 0.3 to 0.4 bar in 10 seconds So my apologies I must have inadvertently misread the manometer and understated the reading when I said my steam boiler only drops by 0.2 bar in 10 seconds, since i cannot reproduce that.

However I don't think that there is any issue with steaming cup after cup. What I did simulated making 5 cups of milk coffee drink one after another to a speed faster than I can grind and prepare for each shot anyway. There was no perceptible diminution of steam power even past 10 seconds to 15 seconds and over.The system recovered in between each burst within a short time (didnt time it but probably between 1 to 2 minutes i would think) to 1.7 bar (it started at the beginning at 1.8 bar).

Was that milk for one though (120-180 mL, 4-6 oz)?

It's the double I'm hoping we can get through with a decent tip, but 0.4 bar in 10 seconds is a big dump.

0.4 bar, is 130°C → 125°C. That takes about 21 kJ/kg to recover, so if 1.2 L in the boiler, about 25 seconds with a 1000 W element.

I wonder how reactive the steam boiler is during steaming?

jontyc wrote:Was that milk for one though (120-180 mL, 4-6 oz)?

It's the double I'm hoping we can get through with a decent tip, but 0.4 bar in 10 seconds is a big dump.

Well I usually use the small jug that's got enough milk for one bodum pavina cup (i think it is the 250ml sized pavina cup but i cannot recall how big exactly these cups i use are as i bought it ages ago) and a little more so I don't know how big that is.

jontyc wrote:0.4 bar, is 130°C → 125°C. That takes about 21 kJ/kg to recover, so if 1.2 L in the boiler, about 25 seconds with a 1000 W element.

I wonder how reactive the steam boiler is during steaming?

I am not technically knowledgeable enough to respond to that but if its the temp of the steam boiler, the pid shows it dropping from 130 to 128 or 127 degrees only at most during those steaming sessions.

I see a drop from 130°C → 128°C when steaming for one on the Izzo 5L, manometer dropping 0.15 bar (1.75 to 1.60). Interesting you're seeing roughly double that as steam tables indeed predict a 0.15 bar drop.

Main thing though is whether steaming milk for two can be sustained without the turbulence dying - I'm sure that will be the case after seeing the Sync's 2 L crawl through 12 oz milk, but simply changing the tip made it kick.