Londinium Compact. - Page 2

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OldNuc

#11: Post by OldNuc »

Denis wrote:Why would that be "fake" preinfusion?

Because you cannot jump directly into 3.5 bar like a line pressure lever.

Are you being serious or just having fun? It's a genuine question.

I am really serious, there is a difference between 1 bar preinfusion and 3.5 bar preinfusion, from the first sec of preinfusion. Try it.

We all know what happens with the puck when you raise the level of Pavoni in under 1 sec full.
Apparently you did not read the Daily Coffee News article linked in this post: Interesting discussion about temperature stability specifically this statement: ... In essence, espresso machines have been temperature and pressure profiling for 70 years. Everything we have built since then has been, in one way or another, trying to duplicate what these early machines did with springs and levers.

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Denis

#12: Post by Denis »

I know exactly what levers do, spring or no spring, 4-6 or 9 bar, hybrid pump+ spring, or only dippers. I had some, I tested some, you need to accept them for what they are and you need to understand what they can and cannot do. I even own an open boiler right now.

The new londinium will be a machine similar to a Pavoni with boiler at 0.6-1.3 bar, 58 mm group, and it will work as a dipper, water comes into the chamber pushed by the pressure build inside the boiler. If you use light coffee, and you work with really low temp, then it will take a few extra time to fill the extraction chamber.

Downs and ups, its better to know all of these before getting a machine. I don't like limited machines, I only like unlimited power, a machine that can mimic all machines, one to rule them all.

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Paul_Pratt

#13: Post by Paul_Pratt »

Denis wrote:I am really serious, there is a difference between 1 bar preinfusion and 3.5 bar preinfusion, from the first sec of preinfusion. Try it.

We all know what happens with the puck when you raise the level of Pavoni in under 1 sec full.
About 3 years ago I built my own double boiler lever group, I can adjust line pressure up to 5 bar if I want, which is our main pressure. After experimenting I just fell back to the 1.1 bar standard.

The point is, and you have answered it yourself, it's a lever. 99.9% of all levers made and sold since 1948 have probably been using pre-infusion at approx 1 bar. It's what they are and why we love/buy them.

If you are looking for extra then buy a pump machine, there are plenty to choose from.
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espressotime

#14: Post by espressotime »

double
Grind,rake ,tamp and enjoy a great espresso.( by F. G.)

elbertfunkleberg

#15: Post by elbertfunkleberg »

Reiss could reduce the size of his current machines by 30% just moving things around a little. Maybe he should start with that.

Schting!

RobindG

#16: Post by RobindG »

Paul_Pratt wrote:After experimenting I just fell back to the 1.1 bar standard.
Hi Paul, can you extract 18 grams of light roast with 1.1 bar PI from a spring lever?

espressotime

#17: Post by espressotime » replying to RobindG »

That can be done without any pre infusion at all.
Dat lukt zelfs zonder pre infusie.
Grind,rake ,tamp and enjoy a great espresso.( by F. G.)

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RobindG

#18: Post by RobindG » replying to espressotime »

Do you get good results? How do you saturate the puck to prevent for channeling?

espressotime

#19: Post by espressotime » replying to RobindG »

I don't drink very light coffee but I do drink medium roasted coffees.The few times I tried light coffees I didn 't experience any channeling issues.
I did use very long pre-infusion times though at about 1.25 bars.But very short pre infusion times worked also.Just not as good. :mrgreen:
Grind,rake ,tamp and enjoy a great espresso.( by F. G.)

yoshi005

#20: Post by yoshi005 »

I extract light roasted coffee with my Faema Lambro with 1.1 to 1.4 bar PI, mostly around 20g of coffe. I get very decent results.

As much as I like Reiss Gunson's strive for the perfect cup, IMHO the L-R wins flexibility but loses simplicity, which is the reason for me to prefer a spring lever over a pump machine.
LMWDP #453