Lever newbie - variable regulating valve for Londinium Compressa

#1: Post by **jbrady3324** » November 29th, 2020, 6:21 pm

I am minutes to days away from pulling the trigger on a Londinium Compressa (I had a great chat with Reiss today). Before jumping in, I will have to admit, I have never used a lever machine so I know very little about tweaking pre-infusion with a valve (its built into the R24 which sounds easier but out of price range and I want to plumb). My question is how does a regulating valve come into play on a daily basis? Does it need to be within reach or can it be in a cabinet (or elsewhere) for when I do need access (ex. changing beans).

#2: Post by **LObin** » November 30th, 2020, 12:27 am

Hello,
Welcome down the rabbit hole!

Can't go wrong with a commercial lever and more so you can't go wrong with a Londinium. The simplicity of the compressa is imo, a great long term investment.

You'll gind lots of threads about plumbing in an espresso machine. The compressa is no different than any HX or commercial machine. Most plumbed-in setups go like this: 1. A 3/8 shut-off valve -> 2. A pressure regulating valve -> 3. Filters -> 4. Machine. Filters have a specific pressure tolerance so the pressure regulating valve needs to be plumbed before those filters.

Usually, 1,2 and 3 are under the counter. I doubt you'll find yourself changing the PI pressure that often so under a cabinet is not a big deal. If you expect you may wanna play with the PI pressure a lot then maybe look into a LR or R24...

Reiss also suggests some sort of leak detector for added security.

Hope this helps!
Cheers!

November 30th, 2020, 10:02 am

For me, with the way our cabinet design is (no room underneath for piping), we elected to put the plumbing in the wall and run it to the basement where I have box where I can install filters. Do you see any problems with that?

November 30th, 2020, 12:10 pm

No problem at all! I've touched my regulator on my plumbed LR maybe three times some I got it in February. You'll find grind and dose has much more affect on shot quality than pi pressure. You'll love your Londinium!

November 30th, 2020, 12:30 pm

Would I need to worry about pressure inaccuracies/variances if the pressure regulator is in the basement? Does the regulator go before or after the filters?

#6: Post by **Jeff** » November 30th, 2020, 12:42 pm

Depending on your supply pressure, you might need a regulator before the filters to stay within their operational limits. You certainly want a shut-off before them so that you can change filters and clean the housings. If stable pressure is desirable at the machine, placing a regulator on the machine side of the filters would be a good idea (pressure drop across the filters will vary slightly with flow as well as with age). If accurate pressure is needed a the machine, the easiest is to place the regulator at the machine. With a height difference you would need to compensate (~1 bar per 33 ft or 10 m of height difference).

November 30th, 2020, 12:53 pm

Thanks Jeff. I attached a picture of the bar/coffee area set up. The machine will be towards the right side of the counter near the countertop cabinet. I don't want to surface mount the regulator valve so that it is in view, so I am thinking I might be able to fit the valve behind the roll-outs in the lower right cabinet or inside the countertop cabinet. Does that seem like a reasonable idea?

#8: Post by **Jeff** » November 30th, 2020, 12:58 pm

The 1/4-turn stop is like the ones under a sink or next to a toilet. 1/4-turn as they're quick and easy to turn on or off, compared to the older multi-turn style. I like to have them accessible without disassembling things, or needing 10 minutes to move things aside. Should you notice something go wrong somewhere, turning off the water should be quick. As the stop and the regulator/gauge are both small, my choice would be to have them "right there" behind/beside the machine. You'll have to decide on your own aesthetics.

#9: Post by **nsuster** » November 30th, 2020, 5:00 pm

jbrady3324 wrote:Would I need to worry about pressure inaccuracies/variances if the pressure regulator is in the basement? Does the regulator go before or after the filters?

To add to what Jeff said, I would add the pressure regulator post filter. There will be a pressure drop across the filter. You will also get a drop based on poly/copper line height (like Jeff said, about 1 bar per 33 feet in height but will vary with flow/line size horizontal as well). Reiss told me you need at least 1 bar at the machine or the boiler won't fill. He said 3 bar would be ideal (aside from up to 6 bar) to experiment with modulating the PI pressure for roast level.

We do not use a softener because our water in Portland is very soft (about 8-10 ppm). My incoming pressure to the filter is ~ 4.5 bar. I don't have the filter yet but will see what the output of the filter is. The filter company said the drop was "negligible" but I've read online it is likely about 0.5 bar. I don't know why they don't publish that data in a data sheet. Max operating pressure of the filter below is 5.5 bar (80 psi) so you will be fine assuming your incoming pressure isn't higher than that.

https://cuzn.com/product/uc-200-under-c ... er-filter/

My Compressa is coming today or tomorrow and this is what I have for plumbed in:

1/4 turn valve off my sink line under the cabinet ->
Filter (company is CuZn) ->
3/8" poly tubing ->
Pressure regulator/gauge ->
3/8" poly tubing ->
John Guest connector for 3/8 tube to 3/8 bspt ->
Supplied bspt braided stainless line

November 30th, 2020, 5:19 pm

I can't wait to hear your feedback on the Compressa! I am still deciding between Compressa and DE1+.

We have figured out how we will plumb which is much like you just described. I am going to have a dedicated copper line, from the basement, come up in the cabinet that sits on the countertop and drill a hole in the side of the cabinet to connect the water supply to machine. This way, the shut off valve and regular will be hidden and still easily accessible (instead of being on the backsplash). In the basement I will have the filters and a regular before the filters if needed.