I'm with Jeff on this one.

Shots with primarily 9 bar of pressure taste "sharp" whereas shots pull between a variation of 6 - 8 bars has yield some of the better tasting shots with a nice mouth feel, and dare I even say better than what I can get from my Rocket Giotto.

ojaw wrote:Though it is true that outdoor humidity goes up in the cold, our winters get cold enough to require big differences (up to 60º C) in outdoor to indoor temps and so our INDOORS become very dry in the winter months.

Yes, of course, good point. I'm nearsighted, thinking of how our windows are open and the indoor morning temperature isn't that much higher than outside (e.g. 10°C vs 15°). And with the kettle boiling away and food being prepared it might actually be more humid in the kitchen.

bcrdukes wrote: Shots with primarily 9 bar of pressure taste "sharp" whereas shots pull between a variation of 6 - 8 bars has yield some of the better tasting shots with a nice mouth feel, and dare I even say better than what I can get from my Rocket Giotto.

Perfect 6-8 !

Jeff wrote:Ignore the crema, go for taste. Medium and lighter roasts usually don't have much crema with any machine or technique. Check James Hofmann's "crema" video for some insight.

6-8 bar should be fine. That's the range I extract medium and lighter roasts most of the time. Going much over that and you end up in a strange place where more pressure can result in less flow, not more.

If you're getting overly sour results, grinding finer and/or a higher temperature can sometimes help. Grinding finer usually means you need "solid" puck prep (perhaps something finer for stirring and leveling, 0.4 mm acupuncture / 3D-printer-cleaning needles are in vogue right now) and even, early infusion to help reduce channeling.

Sey coffee usually roasts very light by US norms. Make sure you let it rest before trying to pull shots. I don't know their recommendations, but a couple weeks or longer would be my g guess.

Thank you so much,

I think that is a valid point. I did not even consider that the bag is from 11/16 so it should definitely have been put to the side.
I will reserve for now the lighter roasts for a different time. I will go back and grab a a darker or medium dark roast. Is it the same method for new bags? Let it sit for 2-3 weeks from the roast date? It is my first experience getting their coffee. The Blend I got from Cafe Cafune.ca - Kaito Love tasted really good but it seems that was not a light roast on further examination.

Roger on Ignore Crema (It looks so pretty though ,

I have an italian espresso bean I got which I will try next and will focus on 6 bars, 190-203 degrees F at a 1.5.2 grind to start with the Kinu.

Appreciate all of the feedback and helping me

In regards to light roasts, I've been playing with "blooming espresso" recently.

- Wet filter paper cut to size in the bottom of the portafilter
- a grind that would either choke or cause a very slow shot even with regular low pressure pre-infusion
- rake the top with a WDT tool, tamp, wet aeropress filter underneath the screen (tight fit)
- ramp up to 4-5 bars over the course of 10 seconds (not sure about this step, the theory is to saturate the whole puck as fast as possible, but increasing the pressure and then backing off is not easy to reproduce manually, perhaps steady low pressure is better in the end.)
- Back off the pressure almost completely. Contrary to the manual, but the filter paper on top seem to preserve puck integrity. Pause for 20 seconds.
- Ramp up to whatever pressure you prefer and pull the shot. For normal/high pressure trail off towards the end.

Extra work, but also higher extractions than I've had with other methods. As a bonus, cleanup is even easier.

So far it made a big difference with the beans I've used, with more berry flavor and sweetness. Pre-heating increased extraction a lot more but those shots were not enjoyable straight - perhaps good with milk.

Have anyone else tried something similar? A lot of variables at work, would be interesting to hear other experiences and perhaps steps that can be skipped.

Hey there,

I guess I am a bit late to the party here (3106 posts already ). I tried to find information about the new gauge since I am thinking to buy a robot soon. What are the major changes between the current gauge and the new one? Is it worth waiting for the new one?

I've never had one at all, but I get the impression that most around here tend to use them initially only and soon develop a feel for the pressure they require (or realize that their taste buds, nose and eyes are more important than an exact number).

I'm about two or three months in with my Robot and really only use the pressure gauge to give me an idea of whereabouts I am. I've developed a bit of a muscle memory knowing where I am between 6 - 8 bar. It's not perfect, but I use it consistently enough to know how much pressure to apply, and ojaw nailed it on the head where I'm using my senses to determine if I'm on track or not.

On the other hand, the reason many of us are not constantly watching the gauge could be more due to its awkward placement than the fact that it's not strictly necessary.

I usually turn the Robot so I can watch the gauge upside down while leaning over. Mainly just to double check the pressure I think I'm pulling at - feedback is pretty good so I'll usually be within 1 bar. Same reason I use a scale and timer - I could do without and be fairly close with practise, but it's nice to know. Of those 3 factors I believe weight/ratio has the most impact.

Jonk wrote:In regards to light roasts, I've been playing with "blooming espresso" recently.

- Wet filter paper cut to size in the bottom of the portafilter
- a grind that would either choke or cause a very slow shot even with regular low pressure pre-infusion
- rake the top with a WDT tool, tamp, wet aeropress filter underneath the screen (tight fit)
- ramp up to 4-5 bars over the course of 10 seconds (not sure about this step, the theory is to saturate the whole puck as fast as possible, but increasing the pressure and then backing off is not easy to reproduce manually, perhaps steady low pressure is better in the end.)
- Back off the pressure almost completely. Contrary to the manual, but the filter paper on top seem to preserve puck integrity. Pause for 20 seconds.
- Ramp up to whatever pressure you prefer and pull the shot. For normal/high pressure trail off towards the end.

Extra work, but also higher extractions than I've had with other methods. As a bonus, cleanup is even easier.

So far it made a big difference with the beans I've used, with more berry flavor and sweetness. Pre-heating increased extraction a lot more but those shots were not enjoyable straight - perhaps good with milk.

Have anyone else tried something similar? A lot of variables at work, would be interesting to hear other experiences and perhaps steps that can be skipped.

I've done something similar to this without bothering with the paper filters. Maybe not quite as long as you describe but close. I don't think there is an issue with puck integretity provided you are careful careful to only reduce pressure, rather than pull up. Pulling up will pull a vacuum on the puck and you don't want that. The bottom paper filter probably allows you to grind even finer, but you can get away with something similar without it.

Posted in the grinder forum, but not much response. Are there "successful" Robot users that grind with a Baratza Forte' BG? using the standard steel burrs. I can't seem to get near a 5 or 6 pressure with mine set on 2Q, which I believe is the finest setting on the Forte'. I'm starting low and working up, but usually done in less than 20 secs. Taste is bitter. Yes, I'm a newbie.