Cafelat Robot User Experience - Page 306

A haven dedicated to manual espresso machine aficionados.
User avatar

#3051: Post by Balthazar_B »

valoben wrote:I don't know how much time he spent with the machine before filming his video, but I also disagree with a few things:
- the puck lift: I don't think I've experienced it, and I do not apply lots of preinfusion pressure
Only ways I can think of to get puck lift is (1) when the tamper is tight enough to suck the puck after tamping, or (2) to lift the arms/levers after the piston is seated in the basket. Applying a lot of immediate pressure to the shot from the get-go will sometimes mitigate the problem, but better to eliminate those errors of technique, of course.
- the way he presses the levers down is not ergonomically correct, pushing at the end of the lever is easier
Neither is very good, frankly, particularly if you're pulling at higher bar pressures. While the amount of pressure needed at the end of the lever is less, the metal is thinner there and gouges the hands more. And as you point out, the strength needed further up the arm is greater. For a time, I'd use something like oven mitts to make pulls less annoying. I'm surprised he didn't use a set of Robot Hands, which would have reduced the severity of the issue.
- John

LMWDP # 577


#3052: Post by VoidedTea »

valoben wrote:I don't know how much time he spent with the machine before filming his video...
That was exactly my thought as well. If I were to make a review of the Robot two days after purchase and then two weeks after purchase, I would end up with two completely different reviews. Hopefully he listens to the comments that were left by many Robot owners, including myself, and practice a bit more.

Regarding the thin shot, my experience was the same as his - I ground too fine at first and all my shots were thin, sour, with very little crema. Grinding a bit coarser, like he finally did, solved the problem.


#3053: Post by Jonk »

Charlemagne wrote:A few issues here.. puck lift? 9 bar PI? Thin and watery? His experience doesn't resemble mine.
Exactly. Sounds to me he's just confused about how pre-infusion works.


#3054: Post by jpender »

I was thinking that maybe he uses the word "literally" to mean "very". That's a common thing nowadays.

Was the idea to make a video from the perspective of somebody who doesn't know what he's doing? I guess that could be sort of useful. At least potentially entertaining, although I found this guy's delivery to be tedious. He needs voice lessons or something. His pitch pattern is repetitive. It's literally the most repetitive thing in the universe.


#3055: Post by Honu »

fun to see reviews

BUT even with 30 years of hard core espresso I watched Pauls videos and said OK great I learned a lot while waiting I came here read through the thread and went OK now I learned some tweaks to the base Paul lays down
my 2nd shot was great my first grind was off but dialed in after that

IMHO like others the puck lift the preheat the hand position ? no idea how long this guy was or is into espresso he has some nice gear and watched a few of his other vids ? they seemed to be more about gadgets ? but could be wrong

I think this is when YouTube folks do a video without really knowing what's up with what they are reviewing did sound like he got some help and learned a bit BUT IMHO he needs to learn more for sure and then maybe do a follow up review AFTER he watches Pauls videos to get the base then read some stuff here to get the tweaks to put on top of the base learning

but glad he did a review fun to see but hope some do not see it and think YIKES that machine is not so good ?
my recent Elektra A3 freaking awesome machine BUT the robot is FUN FUN FUN FUN to use and with the input you have on pressure and playing with preheat or not and so on so many variables BUT again a good base and the thing is just amazingly simple and delivers BUT allows folks to play and change the taste considerable

as said already the puck lift and stuff just shows lack of understanding the machine and only way I can think is he was applying massive pressure and then released quickly and as said above angle on puck maybe ?

hope he sees some of these as constructive from the espresso folks :) so saying hey thanks but take this info and go back and follow up

some of his gadget vids are fun to watch though so he can do good vids IMHO a bit to much talking head not enough product :)


#3056: Post by Ken5 »

As far as pressing the levers down at the ends, I find myself pressing the levers down with an open hand, palms facing down of course, and the curved part of the levers resting on the meaty palms opposite the thumb. Easy to do and painless.



#3057: Post by AZRich »

My robot is not being used/looking for a new home, but when using it I found 2 pieces of 1" pvc plastic pipe about 4" long slipped into the open robot hands can be held very comfortably. Very cheap, yes ugly, and I usually did not press down hard enuf to make them needed. But once in awhile if I almost choked the little guy they were useful.
To a hammer, everything looks like a nail.


#3058: Post by VoidedTea »

Ken5 wrote:As far as pressing the levers down at the ends, I find myself pressing the levers down with an open hand, palms facing down of course, and the curved part of the levers resting on the meaty palms opposite the thumb. Easy to do and painless.

This is how I usually press as well. One more thing I wanted to add, I feel that people are making a common mistake trying to mimic other equipment with the robot. Most commonly, they grind too fine, and as a result, they have to press too hard for too long. No wonder their hands get tired and palms hurt. It happened to me too when I first got the Robot. Some people assume this is normal and try to invent some attachments to solve the pain problem. In my case, I just didn't like the taste of the coffee with this approach and decided to go against conventional "wisdom" and find the right grind size that makes the extraction no longer than 20 seconds at 8 bars. The result? Delicious espresso, no complains about comfort of the press, I can easily press to 8 bars and keep my head in front of the Robot to observe the gauge throughout the entire extraction time, and did I mention delicious espresso? Yes I did. I guess my point is - maybe people should try using the robot the way it was intended to use (my approach is pretty much identical to the user manual), rather than bluntly applying techniques and methods that are more suitable for other machines. And if they don't like the results, then instead of torturing the Robot and themselves, just get a different machine that suits their taste. The Robot is a great tool, but it is not a magic tool. There is a Descent for that.


#3059: Post by ojaw »

VoidedTea wrote:There is a Descent for that.
shots fired


#3060: Post by Ken5 »

Since the last conversation here has to do with a review I just noticed a new comparison between the flair pro 2 and the robot put out by Prima Coffee just a week ago. Thought some of you would enjoy watching it.

He adds 60g of boiling water rather than filling as Paul recommends, perhaps he watched James Hoffman's video. Seems like an extra step to me.

He had two streams coming from the basket the whole pull/push :)

★ Helpful