Cafelat Robot User Experience - Page 297

A haven dedicated to manual espresso machine aficionados.
valoben
Posts: 90
Joined: 4 years ago

#2961: Post by valoben »

iluvcoffee wrote:Apologies for such a newbie question, but I'm confused about the correct brew ratio:

The online manual says" "Begin with a medium dose of around 14 g". If I understand brew ratio basics, that means adding around 2 *14 = 28gm of hot water.

However, the manual also says one should fill the basket to "around 5-8mm of space between the top of the water and the rim of the basket". When I did this for the first time, I measured far more hot water (around 95gm) so that the water was 7mm below the rim.

So, which is it, please?!
Fill it almost to the maximum capacity with water every time. Pull the volume you need, place a second cup for the remaining water
LMWDP #669

User avatar
drgary (original poster)
Team HB
Posts: 14348
Joined: 14 years ago

#2962: Post by drgary (original poster) »

As a beginner it's easy to get lost in numbers. Brew ratio has a lot to do with what coffee and how you're trying to bring out the best taste and mouthfeel. Adjust brew ratio and temperature until the taste is right to you with that particular device. Once you practice a little, the Robot is an analog experience, just like any good cooking.

Espresso 101: How to Adjust Dose and Grind Setting by Taste
Gary
LMWDP#308

What I WOULD do for a good cup of coffee!
★ Helpful

User avatar
GregoryJ
Posts: 1064
Joined: 6 years ago

#2963: Post by GregoryJ »

iluvcoffee wrote:Apologies for such a newbie question, but I'm confused about the correct brew ratio:

The online manual says" "Begin with a medium dose of around 14 g". If I understand brew ratio basics, that means adding around 2 *14 = 28gm of hot water.

However, the manual also says one should fill the basket to "around 5-8mm of space between the top of the water and the rim of the basket". When I did this for the first time, I measured far more hot water (around 95gm) so that the water was 7mm below the rim.

So, which is it, please?!
As others have said, you fill it with much more water than you need to pull the shot, and you stop pushing when you've got the amount of espresso you want.

However... if you did want to add exactly the amount of water you thought you needed, going for a 2:1 ratio, you would need more than 28 grams, because some water gets absorbed by the coffee. It would probably be about another 1g of water per 1g of coffee, but you'd have to find the right amount by trial and error.

User avatar
Balthazar_B
Posts: 1724
Joined: 18 years ago

#2964: Post by Balthazar_B »

GregoryJ wrote: However... if you did want to add exactly the amount of water you thought you needed, going for a 2:1 ratio, you would need more than 28 grams, because some water gets absorbed by the coffee. It would probably be about another 1g of water per 1g of coffee, but you'd have to find the right amount by trial and error.
Great point. Weighing the spent puck afterwards will tell you approximately how many grams of water it's absorbed.
- John

LMWDP # 577

jpender
Posts: 3863
Joined: 11 years ago

#2965: Post by jpender »

Don't forget that you would also have to account for the fact that about one fifth of the puck is in your cup. So, for example, a 15g dose that weighs 30g wet hasn't retained 15g of water; it's something closer to 18g of water.

User avatar
jordanberry
Supporter ♡
Posts: 7
Joined: 4 years ago

#2966: Post by jordanberry »

iluvcoffee wrote:Apologies for such a newbie question, but I'm confused about the correct brew ratio:

The online manual says" "Begin with a medium dose of around 14 g". If I understand brew ratio basics, that means adding around 2 *14 = 28gm of hot water.

However, the manual also says one should fill the basket to "around 5-8mm of space between the top of the water and the rim of the basket". When I did this for the first time, I measured far more hot water (around 95gm) so that the water was 7mm below the rim.

So, which is it, please?!
Either way is absolutely fine! Although I do prefer the 2nd method as I'll explain below.

If you do weight the hot water before you put it in the basket you will likely have to experiment some to get the right amount. Some of the water (not a lot) will be left in the puck so you will have to account for this. The advantage of this method is you don't necessarily have to weight the shot coming out once you get it all dialed in. Also don't get hung up on the 2x ratio. That's just a starting place. Many people have reported preferring closer to a 2.5x ratio. It's best just to experiment and figure out what works best for your beans, setup, etc.

Personally I prefer to fill the basket to a few mm from the top. When i use this method i feel like the levers give me better feedback on how the shot is progressing. I also welcome the additional thermal mass of all that hot water. I guess the only real downside is you do need a container handy to catch the extra water after you've finished your shot.

I'd suggest trying them both and see what works best for you.

Edit: My apologies.. Just realized I answered a question without noticing there was another page that already thoroughly addressed the question. Oops!

User avatar
AZRich
Posts: 207
Joined: 11 years ago

#2967: Post by AZRich »

My basket fits tightly in the portafilter. I confirmed with Paul this was common on some earlier Robots. Could someone with a loose fitting basket and a caliper measure their widest point of their basket for me please?
thanks, Rich

User avatar
Jeff
Team HB
Posts: 6809
Joined: 19 years ago

#2968: Post by Jeff »

Fall 2020 delivery direct from Cafelat, measured at the plane of the rolled-over rim, 59.6 mm ±0.05 mm

User avatar
GregoryJ
Posts: 1064
Joined: 6 years ago

#2969: Post by GregoryJ »

AZRich wrote:My basket fits tightly in the portafilter. I confirmed with Paul this was common on some earlier Robots. Could someone with a loose fitting basket and a caliper measure their widest point of their basket for me please?
thanks, Rich
Hi Rich, I believe the loose fit is due to the portafilter changing, not the baskets.

User avatar
AZRich
Posts: 207
Joined: 11 years ago

#2970: Post by AZRich »

Jeff wrote:Fall 2020 delivery direct from Cafelat, measured at the plane of the rolled-over rim, 59.6 mm ±0.05 m
Thanks Jeff - that is less than mine which is nearly 60mm in one spot so likely would be loose. I'm ok with tight but someone
else might prefer loose.
Rich

Post Reply