Cafelat Robot User Experience - Page 277

A haven dedicated to manual espresso machine aficionados.
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drgary
Team HB

#2761: Post by drgary »

chsreason37 wrote:Anyone from the US interested in a group buy for the robot hands? I'm having a hard time justifying the $30+ shipping for just those at the moment.
If you do a group buy please post it in the Buy/Sell forum rather than continue that in this discussion thread. When you post in Buy/Sell, you can link it back here.
Gary
LMWDP#308

What I WOULD do for a good cup of coffee!

ziggomatic

#2762: Post by ziggomatic »

Excited to share that i've had my robot for a little over a month and the past couple days I've been pulling the best shots ever at home! This includes owning a Linea Mini & Monolith Conical combo for 3+ years & a couple other machines. Let me elaborate.

I had been dosing my shots around 18 grams (as recommended by the two main coffee roasters I've been pulling), and while it was tricky to get the right balance out of the shots, the flavors were good but really nothing exciting.

A couple days ago I decided to start trying 20 gram doses and taste what difference that made, and literally on the first try I was pulling deliciously sweet and balanced shots like never before. This morning was able to pull 2 of the most delicious shots ever at home using Verve Street Level blend. I did about 18 seconds of pre-infusion then ramped pressure up & down to finish with 32 grams out in about 46 seconds. I don't have a pressure gauge on my robot but I would guess I hit around 7-8bars with how much force I was using. Also FYI I preheated the portafilter in a pot of boiling water & also preheated the piston for 15 seconds right before pulling the shot.

Will continue to experiment in this 20 gram ballpark and see what other kind of fine tuning I can use to improve on, but thought it was worth sharing the 20 gram dose range really seems to be the sweet spot for me and my Vario Ceramic burr grinder. Previous coffee that worked great in this range was another light roast blend, Intelligentsia's Sugar Glider espresso (now out of production). I like the Verve much more overall, and also have a bag of their Sermon blend to try.

Loving this Robot more everyday.

equedadoii

#2763: Post by equedadoii » replying to ziggomatic »

Love posts like these! Been eyeing up a Robot for the past few years, and given the coming fall and winter, it is becoming that much more tempting! Anyone ever have any luck stumbling on used Robots? I never know where to look.

garyk

#2764: Post by garyk »

chsreason37 wrote:Anyone from the US interested in a group buy for the robot hands? I'm having a hard time justifying the $30+ shipping for just those at the moment.
Of note, Prima in the USA now has several of the new Robot accessories.
* The new screen (though still the old one in the picture, they say they actually have the new screens)
* The leveling tamper
* The Robot Hands
★ Helpful

sergiyr

#2765: Post by sergiyr »

ziggomatic wrote:Excited to share that i've had my robot for a little over a month and the past couple days I've been pulling the best shots ever at home! This includes owning a Linea Mini & Monolith Conical combo for 3+ years & a couple other machines. Let me elaborate.

I had been dosing my shots around 18 grams (as recommended by the two main coffee roasters I've been pulling), and while it was tricky to get the right balance out of the shots, the flavors were good but really nothing exciting.

A couple days ago I decided to start trying 20 gram doses and taste what difference that made, and literally on the first try I was pulling deliciously sweet and balanced shots like never before. This morning was able to pull 2 of the most delicious shots ever at home using Verve Street Level blend. I did about 18 seconds of pre-infusion then ramped pressure up & down to finish with 32 grams out in about 46 seconds. I don't have a pressure gauge on my robot but I would guess I hit around 7-8bars with how much force I was using. Also FYI I preheated the portafilter in a pot of boiling water & also preheated the piston for 15 seconds right before pulling the shot.

Will continue to experiment in this 20 gram ballpark and see what other kind of fine tuning I can use to improve on, but thought it was worth sharing the 20 gram dose range really seems to be the sweet spot for me and my Vario Ceramic burr grinder. Previous coffee that worked great in this range was another light roast blend, Intelligentsia's Sugar Glider espresso (now out of production). I like the Verve much more overall, and also have a bag of their Sermon blend to try.

Loving this Robot more everyday.
Thanks for sharing! I got a bag of the single origin Armando Fernandez coming in today to try. 46 seconds including the 18s preinfusion? How do you chose the 18s length? Is that when you see the bottom of the portafilter fully beaded or when you get first drops out? Also, I guess since you are doing the preheats it's boiling water in? I will order that one to try next

shabax

#2766: Post by shabax »

Hi! I have my Robot for over 2-3 months now. I was pretty much using it on a daily basis until two weeks ago.
What changed is that I received my Kinu M47 Simplicity at that time, which made a huge difference in terms of consistency of ground beans.
Before that, I would use a blade grinder because the other burr grinder I use was not fine enough for espresso.

What I mostly read from experiences is that shots would usually take 20-30 seconds for blooming, then 1 minute for total brew time, and that would be what I mostly had as an experience with the blade grinder.

However, it takes me a horrible amount of time with the Kinu-ground coffee : 1-2 minutes just for blooming, 10+ minutes at 6-10 bars of pressure for a shot. Needless to say, this is sort of tiring and 20+ minutes for grinding coffee and brewing a shot is not really something I can afford time-wise.
(Kinu is set to 3.3 from the point where it would stop rotating)
The result is a really oily shot, with a lot of complexity...but it's now lukewarm (even with pre-heating the portafilter)

I would simply like to know what would be the expected shot time from experience? That would help me determine what setting I should put my Kinu at.

Thanks!

CoffeeIsJoy

#2767: Post by CoffeeIsJoy »

This sounds to me like you grind way too fine. Most people would take shots of 45-70 seconds. I have the Kinu M47 set between 0.4.0 and 0.7.0, depending on the beans. My experience is that the grind size becomes really fine towards the zero point, meaning your 3.3 could be way too fine. Try a coarser setting.

User avatar
yakster
Supporter ♡

#2768: Post by yakster »

Levers are more forgiving of a longer shot but they should take less than a minute or two total. Sounds like you need to coarsen your grind setting. You should also be able to grind faster at a coarser setting, which should help with your workflow.
-Chris

LMWDP # 272

dwillym

#2769: Post by dwillym »

If I'm understanding that right, it's taking you 10 minutes to pull a shot? I don't know how that's possible...

I've had my Robot for about a week now and am starting to really dial it in. I think it's worth trying a coarser grind as others have suggested. I would also suggest being more purposeful about pre-infusion (getting the water to gently soak through the grinds before you apply real pressure).

I'm using a Lido E-T on a setting of maybe 3.5 from zero, which probably doesn't translate well to your grinder, but for the Lido is super fine. If I just load it up and try and push down there is some legit resistance, but if I let the levers down and push gently, just a bit until I see coffee droplets start to form all over the bottom of the portafilter (this takes maybe 5 seconds or so), then when I start to apply real pressure it feels much more fluid and consistent.

Good luck!

hobomotorhome

#2770: Post by hobomotorhome »

shabax wrote:Hi! I have my Robot for over 2-3 months now. I was pretty much using it on a daily basis until two weeks ago.
What changed is that I received my Kinu M47 Simplicity at that time, which made a huge difference in terms of consistency of ground beans.
Before that, I would use a blade grinder because the other burr grinder I use was not fine enough for espresso.

What I mostly read from experiences is that shots would usually take 20-30 seconds for blooming, then 1 minute for total brew time, and that would be what I mostly had as an experience with the blade grinder.

However, it takes me a horrible amount of time with the Kinu-ground coffee : 1-2 minutes just for blooming, 10+ minutes at 6-10 bars of pressure for a shot. Needless to say, this is sort of tiring and 20+ minutes for grinding coffee and brewing a shot is not really something I can afford time-wise.
(Kinu is set to 3.3 from the point where it would stop rotating)
The result is a really oily shot, with a lot of complexity...but it's now lukewarm (even with pre-heating the portafilter)

I would simply like to know what would be the expected shot time from experience? That would help me determine what setting I should put my Kinu at.

Thanks!
I believe you are grinding way too fine. I have the exact same setup, though no grinders are the exactly the same settings. I grind 2 full rotations plus at least another half rotation from burrs touching, 2.5+/- full rotations. Let the beans and taste dictate from there. I use light pressure ~1/2 bar, till the bottom is fully beaded and a drop or two falls, takes 5 or 10 seconds, then 30-40 seconds for the rest of the pull. on occasion including pre-infusion total time is about 1 minute. Let taste dictate, if it tastes good and its a little longer or shorter, no matter, it tastes good.