Cafelat Robot User Experience - Page 206

A haven dedicated to manual espresso machine aficionados.
ojaw

#2051: Post by ojaw »

I still don't think that's the issue though because my flow varies with my untimed infusions and somewhat changeable (on purpose) pressing of the arms.

thirdcrackfourthwave

#2052: Post by thirdcrackfourthwave »

Isaac wrote:I just pulled what I would consider my first "god" shot. I've always felt like I don't know if what I'm doing is "right" since this is my first espresso machine and I haven't had the coffee I'm using (The Answer by Cat & Cloud) prepared professionally. I'd also been sticking with the recipe James Hoffmann uses in his Robot first look (17g grounds, ~60g water) and while the shots were good they never blew me away. Anyways I decided to try the recipe that C&C recommends for the blend (19.2g in 30g out, 28-30s) and I have to say I think I nailed it. I got the weight spot on (really should've paid more attention to how much I poured in, I think it was around 40g water), no idea about infusion time. But regardless, it was the best shot I'd drank and I could actually taste each of the notes they describe.

I didn't just come here to gush though, I do have a question.

I'm not sure if I'm just an incredible weakling (entirely possible!) or not but it seems to get the 6+ - ~8ish bars of pressure I'm having to grind pretty finely but also it requires a lot of effort on my end -- certainly more than it seems others are exerting in videos. I'm coming away from shots with the robot's hands indented into my own hands and it kind of hurts. Just wondering if this is normal or I need to hit the weights.

And also super interested in that tamper paul posted earlier, hope things work out with it :D
I don't know why Hoffman measures the 60 grams of water going in. Just fill it to where Paul Pratt suggests. The important amount of liquid is what ends up in the cup.

One suggestion with regards to the position of the Robot. . . .it might be easier if the Robot is lower than standard counter height for some people. My wife is short. Anyhow I did try a mod with foam pipe insulation. She did not like it. I did not like it. You might like it. Anyhow I don't have any 'ergonomic' issues as is.

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drgary
Team HB

#2053: Post by drgary »

Isaac wrote:I'm not sure if I'm just an incredible weakling (entirely possible!) or not but it seems to get the 6+ - ~8ish bars of pressure I'm having to grind pretty finely but also it requires a lot of effort on my end -- certainly more than it seems others are exerting in videos. I'm coming away from shots with the robot's hands indented into my own hands and it kind of hurts. Just wondering if this is normal or I need to hit the weights.
Beginners tend to follow the formula to get the best shot for a particular coffee. Someone told me long ago, let the machine teach you its sweet spot. If your grind is so fine you have to do a downward bench press, you're grinding too fine. The Robot was originally conceived as a simple, analog device without a pressure gauge. I believe people get away from the lever experience by overthinking it. For the flavors of coffee you like, set a grind that's comfortable for pulling a shot. Don't measure success by getting 8 bars of pressure.* Adjust the dose and the grind for a similar feel and adjust temperature to dial in the shot. Keep it comfortable. Maybe even ignore the seconds ticking away. If your pull is 25 or 35 seconds, will you really taste much difference, all else being the same?
Gary
LMWDP#308

What I WOULD do for a good cup of coffee!

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MB

#2054: Post by MB »

I recall seeing something about the designer, Paul, pulling many shots at some expo event at much less than 8 bar. I agree with Dr. Gary and others that have posted - I don't focus on a specific number, I go mostly by flow. If I am having to muscle through a shot, next time I grind coarser. If things go too fast and easy, next time I grind finer. Between those, the window is fairly wide for tasty espresso (given a nicely capable grinder and good fresh beans).
LMWDP #472

jpender

#2055: Post by jpender »

thirdcrackfourthwave wrote:I don't know why Hoffman measures the 60 grams of water going in. Just fill it to where Paul Pratt suggests. The important amount of liquid is what ends up in the cup.

He didn't have a scale that would fit the Robot. So he worked it out by experimenting with how much water would result in a particular weight in the cup if you push all the water through.

The problem with his approach is while you're weighing the water it's cooling off. I like Mr. Hoffmann but he had some weird ideas about thermal loss in that video.

ojaw

#2056: Post by ojaw »

MB wrote:I recall seeing something about the designer, Paul, pulling many shots at some expo event at much less than 8 bar. I agree with Dr. Gary and others that have posted - I don't focus on a specific number, I go mostly by flow.
6-7 bar is the number stated in the manual, I'll bet mine are often less than that.

jpender

#2057: Post by jpender »

ojaw wrote:I still don't think that's the issue though because my flow varies with my untimed infusions and somewhat changeable (on purpose) pressing of the arms.

Sure. Preinfusion, grind fineness, pressure -- those all affect flow. But the "spatters a bit to the sides" issue sounds like some type of uneven flow. I'd love to see exactly what you're talking about as I'm not sure I've experienced it.

jpender

#2058: Post by jpender »

ojaw wrote:6-7 bar is the number stated in the manual, I'll bet mine are often less than that.

I usually aim for 7 bar, sometimes it's 8. Sometimes it's 6. When it's less I grind finer.

I'm not particularly strong, although I sometimes smell that way.

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drgary
Team HB

#2059: Post by drgary »

Too much information? :P
Gary
LMWDP#308

What I WOULD do for a good cup of coffee!

ojaw

#2060: Post by ojaw »

jpender wrote: Sure. Preinfusion, grind fineness, pressure -- those all affect flow. But the "spatters a bit to the sides" issue sounds like some type of uneven flow. I'd love to see exactly what you're talking about as I'm not sure I've experienced it.
I'm terrible at video but maybe at some point I'll give it a go.