Abe Carmeli wrote:
Why am I not surprised... As far as producing the drink, I think the competition should allow some leeway to deviate from common practices. There is no room for innovation otherwise.

every sport has common hardware rules, innovation or not. check out the rules for just about any form of auto racing. in the USBC, competitors are not allowed to change the equipment in any way. otherwise folks would be using custom steam tips, custom showerscreens, custom baskets, etc, etc. perhaps the rules will change in the future, as this is a continually evolving event, but for right now, everyone has to play by the same rules.

barry wrote: every sport has common hardware rules, innovation or not. check out the rules for just about any form of auto racing. in the USBC, competitors are not allowed to change the equipment in any way. otherwise folks would be using custom steam tips, custom showerscreens, custom baskets, etc, etc. perhaps the rules will change in the future, as this is a continually evolving event, but for right now, everyone has to play by the same rules.

What I fear is that we are stifling the very spirit we are trying to develop. The last thing you want is for espresso making to become a dogma. Tennis has a lot of rules, but none of them is related to how the player hits the ball, what technique he uses. As I agree that some things must be standardized in the competition, grinding into the basket is hardly changing the equipment. The basket is not really part of the P/F, it is attached to it with a clip. The only change here is in the Barista technique.

i think there's a little concern about starting down a slippery slope wrt messing with equipment. also, pulling baskets out to dose/tamp is hardly practical in a professional setting (however handy it may be for some for brewing at home).

abe, consider getting in on judging, so you can really see how things work and maybe even help improve them.

barry wrote: abe, consider getting in on judging, so you can really see how things work and maybe even help improve them.

I have been thinking about it. The NE Regional is held in New York next year. I will give it a try.

If you don't mind me jumping in on this discussion,

actually, to be completely honest, I'd rather not have Abe as a judge, if that's the sort of perspective that he's going to come in with.

The fact is, competing is really, really difficult. Think you're hot stuff in your kitchen? To put things into perspective: Abe, you've pulled hundreds and thousands of espresso shots, right? You've experimented and somewhat developed some sort of technique (which I guess involves popping out the baskets for you). Good.

Now, imagine that you're at the competition as a competitor. You have 15 minutes to set up all of your gear, so you'd better be damn sure you have every piece of everything totally laid out in your mind and on your cart. You're wearing clothes that you normally wouldn't ever be barista'ing in. 15 minutes to prepare, on a machine and grinder that you've had no more than 15 minutes (during open practice time) to spend any time on. You don't know the way the water temps will fluctuate, but you're on a Marzocco Linea 3AV, which means about ± 6*F. The machine-prep people who cleaned your station before you flushed the hell out of the machine, which dropped the brew boiler temps a good bit. Sure hope it'll recover by the time you're up!

Dial in your grind, pull some shots, lay out your stuff, and get cleaning. Then your set-up time is over, and you stand and wait for 8 minutes for the last competitor to finish, and the judges to finish deliberating over their performance.

Then you get up to go. Keep in mind, the grind that you set has been sitting for 12 minutes since you last pulled a shot. Now. Get to work. Hope you're not nervous!

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This is but only a small nibble off of all of the unique challenges that the barista competitor faces.

I'd love to see a (at least) mock-competition requirement from all judges before they're certified to judge. The judges shouldn't be coming from a perspective of, "Okay barista... impress me." They should come in with some level of respect, understanding how hard it is to compete, and be like, "It's my honor to be your judge."

Nick wrote:I'd love to see a (at least) mock-competition requirement from all judges before they're certified to judge. The judges shouldn't be coming from a perspective of, "Okay barista... impress me." They should come in with some level of respect, understanding how hard it is to compete, and be like, "It's my honor to be your judge."

Nick,

Yes, I am disappointed with the competition. It needs a serious overhaul for the very reasons you've mentioned. I have a lot of respect for people who compete in front of an audience. I have done it myself numerous times in a different discipline, and I know very well how it feels to be on the receiving end of it. But, perhaps because I've been there, I know what it can be, and the USBC just ain't it. Please do not take it as an insult, but rather as a comment from a person who cares about it, and would like to see it reach its potential.

You want my respect as a competitor? Then make your best effort to earn it. There are no discounts there. But this is not really the competitor's fault alone. The organization needs to look at the conditions they put the competitors in. Some examples for improvements? Give the competitors 2 days before the competition to work on the equipment. Let them feel comfortable. Machine prep causing problem in temperature? change the procedure to avoid it. Time is too short? perhaps add a few minutes to the rules and see if it improves performance. In later years, once the training wheels are off the competition, gradually reduce the time back to its original.

The USBC is new in the competitive arts circuit, but such competitions have been held in other disciplines for centuries. There is a lot to be learned from them. They are in many cases a great force in developing the discipline itself. I'd like to see that happen to espresso. We will all benefit from it.

Nick wrote:I'd love to see a (at least) mock-competition requirement from all judges before they're certified to judge.

Mine are simple:

1) don't puke or wet yourself;

2) don't sweat in my drink;

3) serve me something tasty.

Abe Carmeli wrote:Yes, I am disappointed with the competition. It needs a serious overhaul for the very reasons you've mentioned. I have a lot of respect for people who compete in front of an audience. I have done it myself numerous times in a different discipline, and I know very well how it feels to be on the receiving end of it. But, perhaps because I've been there, I know what it can be, and the USBC just ain't it. Please do not take it as an insult, but rather as a comment from a person who cares about it, and would like to see it reach its potential.

Duly noted.

However, there are a few different elements here that I'd wanna mentally separate: the competition, and the competitors, and the general "state of the barista craft" in the country and in the world.

The competition? If it's fair, and after all is said and done, you really do see the best baristas rise to the top and win these competitions, then what else do you need? Whether you give them an hour, or 5 minutes, it shouldn't matter. If it's fair, and it rewards true excellence... that, the competitions do indeed accomplish.

It's flawed for sure. There are a growing number of folks (some who DO have some access to the WBC governing body) who are proposing a comprehensive overhaul of the WBC/USBC competitions. The biggest problem with the competitions are the judging, the skill of the competitors, and the "spectator sport" element.

Abe Carmeli wrote:Some examples for improvements? Give the competitors 2 days before the competition to work on the equipment. Let them feel comfortable. Machine prep causing problem in temperature? change the procedure to avoid it. Time is too short? perhaps add a few minutes to the rules and see if it improves performance. In later years, once the training wheels are off the competition, gradually reduce the time back to its original.

Why put training wheels on at all? We're not talking about children. What's the point of just giving all of the competitors a 50 point boost? The scoring is relative anyway.

Abe Carmeli wrote:The USBC is new in the competitive arts circuit, but such competitions have been held in other disciplines for centuries. There is a lot to be learned from them. They are in many cases a great force in developing the discipline itself. I'd like to see that happen to espresso. We will all benefit from it.

No argument there.

What I would add though is that not only has espresso not been around for centuries, but this level of barista craft is really in its infancy and is being developed worldwide as we speak.

It's not like the Food Network Wedding Cake Challenge that I just watched on TV a couple of nights ago, in which from a community of thousands of highly skilled pastry chefs around the country, you take the elite few and marvel at their brilliance and years of training and experience. As an M.C. at regional, USBC, and WBC competitions, I ask almost every barista how long they've been a barista. The range is from 6 months to 5 years, with the average being about 2.5 years. Once we have an industry and a culture with a good-sized pool of 10-15 year veterans of premium espresso, it'll be fascinating to see how this particular "competitive art" has developed over the years.

Do take solace/comfort though, in the knowledge that there are indeed, people who are aware of the various issues... and are working to do something about it.

That being said, the competitions aren't for everyone. Right now in this country, there are few (if any) other opportunities for a passionate barista to do something that goes beyond working behind her or his shop's espresso bar... so we see many competitors who frankly seem to have no clue about competitions. As the barista profession develops (thanks in most part to the Barista Guild of America ), we'll see the caliber of competitor improve dramatically.

barry wrote:Mine are simple:

1) don't puke or wet yourself;

2) don't sweat in my drink;

3) serve me something tasty.

Whatever Barry.

We all know your #1 thing is: Close your refrigerator door.

Nick wrote: Whatever Barry.

We all know your #1 thing is: Close your refrigerator door.

How many competitors demonstrate good food safety practices?

Closing the door to the fridge may just be an annoyance thing but it begs the question, at least in my house where a health dept employee lives, is food safety even considered at the competitions? I dunno, I have not been to one.

Regards,
Sean