Espresso 201 - Page 2

Want to talk espresso but not sure which forum? If so, this is the right one.
Nunas
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#11: Post by Nunas »

1. Get that PID for cryin out loud
Unless I'm mistaken, your machine is an HX with a pressure-stat. If so, a PID should not be your #1 concern, and some would argue that it should not be a concern at all (me included). In an HX machine, a pressurestat provides stable enough boiler temperature. Unlike an SBDU or a DB machine, HX brew water does not come from the boiler, but from the reservoir, passing through the HX inside the boiler. While it is true that a PID will more accurately control the temperature of the boiler than will most pressure-stats, the brew temperature is by far much more a matter of how you run the HX loop. IMHO, PIDs are offered on HX machines simply because of misplaced public demand. Don't misunderstand, I'm not opposed to having a PID on an HX machine; I just don't see the utility. I agree with your #2 and #3.

Bluenoser
Posts: 1436
Joined: 6 years ago

#12: Post by Bluenoser »

mad1 wrote:Thanks to the posters for your input. It looks like a new machine is not the next step for me at the moment. Here is my order of operations then:

1. Get that PID for cryin out loud

madhu
Having gone the HX route, if you are doing a PID HX, I'd really try to find one that will tell you the temp of the brew water easy.. Either a brand that has such a sensor in the show screen or else make sure you get a permanent thermometer mounted in the head. If you are going DB, it is more consistent, but most have the temp sensor too far from the group and then you have to fiddle with an offset.

Just saw the post above.. In my HX PID, it *has* reduced the need to flush.. but there is a downside I'm finding in mine. The recovery can be long between shots. After 1 shot, my thermometer is showing the temp dip about 5F. It can take 5-10 minutes for that to come back on my Profitec 500PID. I am guessing the thermosyphon is slowing this down. Without a PID the boiler is often hotter but you'll need to do cooling flushes (thermometer will help immensely). I'm still glad I have the PID as I think it has to add a bit of consistency. But don't mistake that for helping to know the *absolute* brew water temp. Nothing but a thermometer will help determine what that is.

In my year at this, brew water temperature was my biggest hurdle and I tried everything to not have to install my own thermometer (cups with thermocouples, etc).. but in the end.. Eric's thermometer was the only way for me to begin to learn how my machine works thermally.. Getting something to measure pressure is good too.. the pressure gauge on my machine does not seem to mirror the group pressure very accurately. But pressure monitoring is secondary to temperature, I think.. at least in my early learning stage it was.

Nick Name
Posts: 680
Joined: 9 years ago

#13: Post by Nick Name »

Based on the review on this site I believe Alexia is a single boiler, not a heat exchanger.

For a single boiler a PID upgrade is very useful. Although you can learn to master temperature surfing, a PID makes life a lot easier and makes espresso making a whole lot more fun. No more counting seconds from the temp cycle of the thermostat. Just pull the shot and you'll know what you get without too much hassle. Updating the machine makes sense only if you pull a lot of cappuccinos or other milk drinks. And even then I doubt it would make the coffee better but just making cappuccino producing a bit easier. Unless you're into cappuccinos or flow and pressure profiling you can stick with the Alexia for now.

For updating the barista skills, longer brew time should be experimented. Especially East African single origins love longer extractions to get all that sweetness out of them - and as they usually are roasted on the lighter side, longer extraction easies on the sourness as well. 25-30s is the old guideline which still works perfectly well with old school espresso roasts, but with modern lighter espresso roasts you have to try something different. Just be aware of channeling which is always a risk if your extractions are on the longer side. A good grinder and puck preparation are essential.

I suggest picking up the Pharos and start using it until you can get a new electric grinder. Monolith seems to be the way to go (once you can decide whether you want a conical or a flat version of it). Besides Monolith there are other cheaper grinder options. Since you already have the Pharos, you don't have to jump in to get a new grinder but you can make your decision wisely after reading the wealth of grinder discussions on the forum.

mad1 (original poster)
Posts: 65
Joined: 9 years ago

#14: Post by mad1 (original poster) »

Wow. Great advice and input so far. Yes, "Nick Name" above is right - the Alexia is a SBDU. So yeah, it's decided - I'm PID'ing it, resurrecting the Pharos, going for longer shots, and eventually getting a titan motorized grinder. Gonna call Hitech Espresso the day after New Year's Day.

mad1 (original poster)
Posts: 65
Joined: 9 years ago

#15: Post by mad1 (original poster) »

Just an update, and responding to other posters.

Following the consensus above, I bought a Compak K10 Pro Barista from a fellow forum member. I don't know if it's new gadget effect, but I'm seeing a huge difference. The biggest change for me is that shots are less "harsh", my palate recovers in 20-30 minutes (versus the hour or two it would take with the Vario). The Vario has been relegated to AeroPress duties, which it performs admirably.

I installed Eric's grouphead thermometer, and can definitely see the correlation between grouphead temperature and taste. And I can see the wild wild swings in grouphead temperature, if I don't temp surf. I'm getting the PID installed soon - Hitech is waiting for some parts

I do have VST baskets, and 99% of the time, dose 18g in the VST 18g basket.

Thanks again to the community.

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