What's a light roast? - Page 14

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.
User avatar
Denis

#131: Post by Denis » Jun 05, 2019, 12:56 am

Competitions are so you can be evaluated by someone and see what is your level of knowledge, it opens your mind. You recently took part in a competition, so don't say you don't care about competitions. Competitions are so people find out about you, so it's like free publicity.

For now its great that people drink a lot of milk beverages, so the roast doesn't matter that much, or it sits under a shadow curtain in the corner, but things are evolving, and an educated taste is more present, or if you want a subjective educated taste.

And it's funny because like a few months ago you didn't even know about fruity bomb light fast roasts, with a fast drop, but you are trying them, so if you are happy and in peace with what you do and cont care about other why even bother trying other type of roasts?

I tried a lot of specialty coffee, from many countries, and lately I have been trowing away a lot because of the lack of quality, the sorting is not there, I get beans of all dimensions, the roast is not even, the taste is not great and soon I will prove it by measuring EY% in espresso. And this is not an assumption, this is a reality, because I already have measuring data, but they are not made by me, so I need my own. I am speaking only about light roast, I have 0 interest in trying out espresso roast, I don't buy espresso roast.

crunchybean

#132: Post by crunchybean » Jun 05, 2019, 1:03 am

Almico wrote:Each one of them said they do their light roast on the Probat and darker roasts on the Loring
I agree, if someone told me this two years ago that would have save me a lot of time :p Was it me or did people think the opposite then?

pngboy

#133: Post by pngboy » Jun 05, 2019, 2:32 am

In the end I think its the skills and knowledge of the driver that matters.

User avatar
Almico
Supporter ♡

#134: Post by Almico » Jun 05, 2019, 5:54 am

crunchybean wrote:I agree, if someone told me this two years ago that would have save me a lot of time :p Was it me or did people think the opposite then?
I had assumed it would be the other way around, if we're believing the internet yada-yada that "air roasters produce brighter tasting coffee". I asked the "stump the roaster" panel that question specifically, and each one said they used the Probat for light roasts and the Loring for dark. Their reasoning had nothing to do with taste. It was about controlling the roaster.

I've said this before, roasting light is easy. Roasting dark we'll is quite challenging. On a Probat you can practically turn the gas off after a few seconds into 1C, let the beans coast for a minute and drop. With a dark roast you have to ride a fine line between maintaining enough heat to get to 2C in a reasonable amount of time, yet not let the beans exotherm and have RoR rise.

The Loring can do this well because the heat is coming from controllable exhaust air feeding back into the roast environment.
pngboy wrote:In the end I think its the skills and knowledge of the driver that matters.
Yep. If only buying a better guitar would make me a better player.

crunchybean

#135: Post by crunchybean » Jun 05, 2019, 8:56 am

For me another competing factor is also that it is hard for the air roaster to get enough bean structure breakdown for lighter roasts. I have no problem getting to flavor country but since I manual grind, light roasts are murder.

false1001

#136: Post by false1001 » Jun 05, 2019, 11:42 am

Almico wrote:I've said this before, roasting light is easy. Roasting dark we'll is quite challenging.
Before I got the Bullet I would have agreed with you, but now I'm able to hit the medium/medium-dark sweetspot with ease while I'm severely struggling with any kind of filter roast, be it light or medium-light.

dale_cooper

#137: Post by dale_cooper » replying to false1001 » Jun 05, 2019, 3:41 pm

Curious - what about your light or medium-light roasts do you find not up to par on the bullet? I really enjoy my attempts.

false1001

#138: Post by false1001 » replying to dale_cooper » Jun 05, 2019, 5:13 pm

https://roast.world/r/ahvRmp43WzK_fS_qRY4Yl

The above link is probably my best light roast attempt so far. The greens have been vacuum sealed/refrigerated for about a year, and I had previously roasted another vacuum sealed/refrigerated batch on my DIY roaster right before I got the bullet about a month ago, so I know the greens were holding up. The last of one of my favorite batches of greens from the past year or so. The best roast from those beans resulted in a cup that had a sweet lemon acidity, almost like fresh lemonade without too much sugar added, a delicious raisin middle note, and a prominent milk chocolate note to finish. Nothing super refined or exotic but a delicious daily driver that could be made pourover, espresso, with milk, etc.

The roast from my bullet was so muted it was disheartening. Barely any brightness, no real raisin flavors, just a jammy/fruit preserve kind of note, and a very roasty bordering on bitter chocolate at the end. Not a terrible drink by any means, but nowhere near what I had been getting before. And that's just the best case. If I drop even with 5 seconds left to go in FC I get strong grassiness. Waiting until FC ends risks dominant roasty notes. There seems to be a very tiny sweet spot for light roasts, in my opinion.

Edit: https://roast.world/r/KxWxH579QWZ3N6BklYrTc an example of a roast where I raced through drying, spent too long in maillard, and still dropped too soon. result was roasty, underwhelming, and didn't get rid of it's grassiness until about a week after roast.
★ Helpful

dale_cooper

#139: Post by dale_cooper » replying to false1001 » Jun 05, 2019, 6:32 pm

Assuming your batches are really 450 or 500g ... I think you're using too much heat and too much fan. F2 through dry end. F3 at like 150C and then maybe go into f4. Also use p6, maybe p7. I do agree that the light roasts can get roasty if you're not careful. I actually think I should try more instances of dropping with barely any increase in development temps.

OldmatefromOZ

#140: Post by OldmatefromOZ » Jun 05, 2019, 10:01 pm

false1001 wrote:https://roast.world/r/ahvRmp43WzK_fS_qRY4Yl

The above link is probably my best light roast attempt so far. .
I think Jim was pointing you in the right direction.
If you can keep the total roast time the same 9:15 with First crack starting at 8:00 to 8:15 you will get more of what you want.

You dont want more / longer maillard flavours and your profile is already too flat. So you will have to drop your charge temp significantly. Try the soak and at 1:30 use your max heat setting then leave it be.

You want a return to 100C around 2 mins.

Time to full yellow should be 50 to 55% depends when you call it.

Keep fan at "medium" for entire roast, you are better off not playing around with it until you get what you want in the cup.

Just after full yellow make slight adjustment to power down, this may only need to be P7 to P6 for example.
At 10C before first crack make your final adjustment and stick with it / ride it out....taste and repeat or with 1 change to that final setting.

Minimal power adjustments in a BALANCED roast profile produce the sweetest cups, especially if roasting light.