Playing with RoR Curve Shape & Artisan Designer Tool - Page 2

June 9th, 2018, 11:47 am

crunchybean wrote:I have found that similar beans ( 1st)terrior 2nd) varietals) will roast similarly so one profile you have found how to apply the heat to that bean and get the flavor/texture you want, massive variations in profile will not amplify what you are going for and then small tweaks are required. So for two different Ethiopian from Sidamo (different years crop), will roast very similar even though the heirloom varietal composition is random (at least to me). Also I have found that creating very specific profiles will get you very specific flavors, so you will be losing out on "complexity" of having multiple fruits ect, but you may get one note/texture from each category in the beginning middle and end that are very distinct. That is said to share what I have observed. These I am sure, are not new observations, but may help if you find yourself lost. I have not been able to eliminate the baked nose from the hot cup and if you have any ideas on that I'm all ears. On that note, I have not mastered the Rao Method so that advice I am still working on.

It's like learning the play the saxophone. At this point I'm trying to just eliminate the squeals and squawks. I'll focus on playing good music later.

Then I'll need to find a roaster that will do what I need it to do.

#12: Post by **MaKoMo** » June 9th, 2018, 12:58 pm

Almico wrote:Designer is a great tool. In order to achieve my desired RoR curve, milestone times and temps had to be adjusted. It basically told me when dry and 1C had to be, given the temps I normally get only roaster. Very cool.

Alan, the designer in Artisan was added by Rafael 7 years ago exactly for the purpose of experimenting with profiles. Glad that you find it useful. Keep on documenting what you do!

June 9th, 2018, 8:21 pm

I'm having too much fun to stop now, Marko!

Here is an Ethiopian Yirga Idido that's been laying around. I tried to follow my light roast template.

#14: Post by **DonJuan** » June 10th, 2018, 4:19 am

Looks great, can you post a snap shot of your PID settings.. thanks

June 10th, 2018, 5:07 am

No PID. I roast completely manually.

#16: Post by **Cafeneo** » June 11th, 2018, 4:54 am

Are you still routinely doing a heat bump at or around FCs to avoid 'crash'?
I'm still trying to play with this and it's been a slow go.

June 11th, 2018, 5:41 am

I only do it on the Sumatra. Interesting that this year's crop needs it just as much as last years. My other coffees, except maybe a Kenya from time to time, do not crash in my roaster: likely because the roasting air is dispelled almost as soon as it it introduced. The air in the roaster is turned over constantly. That's what makes the very hard crash of the Sumatra so intriguing to me.

#18: Post by **Andy** » June 12th, 2018, 12:47 am

Alan, Thanks for starting this thread. There is precious little detailed discussion of fluid bed roasting on this forum and I often wonder how much drum roasting information applies to my rig.
Couple of questions: In another thread, I think I remember that you said you do not pre-heat your roaster; has that changed? If I am reading your graphs right, it looks like you are charging variously at 175°F to 275°F. Also, what is your charge weight. I roast with a modified popper -- heat and fan are controllable -- and I struggle to get the control you are able to get.

June 12th, 2018, 2:04 pm

I don't preheat for the first roast of the day. For subsequent roasts, the heat box is already hot and it doesn't make sense to cool it down.

I charge 80oz with the fan on and heat off. This allows the heat already in the box to start drying the beans. Once the temp comes down to around 1:30 I kick in the heat and the real roasting begins. It's nice that way because my curves now resemble drum curves.

The charge heat temp depends on how long it takes me to start the next batch. It drops quickly in the heat box. Either way, I adjust the heat so the BT curve joins the template curve as soon as possible.

June 27th, 2018, 11:15 am

The experiment of straight line declining RoR curves have come to an end. I've been playing with this profile for dark roasts for 2 weeks:

The taste was defect free...and flavor/sweetness free as well.

I tried my old profile yesterday and made a pour over at the bar last night and was blown away with how sweet it was in comparison:

I did this roast over the experimental profile so I could go back and see the deviation if the cup turned out well. Boy, did it ever.

With the experimental profile I needed to keep the heat a bit low in the beginning, and then gradually increase it to keep the RoR line straight.

So the fact that the RoR continually decreased in the flat line RoR roast did not guarantee conservation of sweetness.

It seems getting energy into the bean pre-dry, rather than just "slow-cooking" is key.