Light Roasts on the Bullet R1 - Page 2

Discuss roast levels and profiles for espresso, equipment for roasting coffee.
wayneg1

#11: Post by wayneg1 » Jun 09, 2019, 10:15 pm

yakster wrote:I love seeing more Bullet roaster topics in H-B. I really don't like using Facebook and I'm not sure how I feel about posting my true feelings on Aillio's own forum. I also haven't calibrated the fan yet.
I couldn't agree with you more. It would be nice to see more Bullet activity on HB. Facebook is helpful if you need 3d prints; there are some talented people willing to help there.

The Aillio forum is dominated by pontification and droning on and on. I get to the first sentence and doze off.

I wonder if it's just that too many Bullet owners are not familiar with this site.

false1001

#12: Post by false1001 » Jun 10, 2019, 1:53 pm

winslette wrote:This is excellent, I was hoping to have a split topic for light roasting on the Bullet. What is more, I am actually in the process of having the same Burundi bean for about the past 3 weeks.
I creeped on your Aillio profile and see you also got the Colombia HP Aponte Community... such a great all around bean. What were your Burundi v60 parameters?

false1001

#13: Post by false1001 » Jun 10, 2019, 2:06 pm

Two more attempts at the Burundi...

https://roast.world/r/P2mTuUP2erYuahfUAsiN6
Cupping Score: 75.75
Description: Weirdly non descript. Not too much roastiness, mostly in the finish (I had the RoR spike before FC again on this roast), but besides that really nothing in the cup. The aroma and fragrance was pretty good though.

https://roast.world/r/O2BnNJ1fDWfxaaOj2ywbR
Cupping Score: 79.75
Description: Definitely the best roast of this bean yet, but like the last one very non-descript in cupping. No roastiness to this one though (no pre-FC RoR spike!!!), which is a plus. Aroma was really incredible with stone fruit, honey, caramel and there were some tea notes to the flavor but besides that... just... nothing. Maybe a slight caramel finish?

Has anyone experienced this before with cupping? I'm fairly certain that last roast is a "good" roast given the profile and aroma, but I couldn't get it during the cupping. Maybe I have to play with the grind? I'll make both of these in pourover and see what happens.

winslette

#14: Post by winslette » Jun 10, 2019, 2:21 pm

false1001 wrote:I creeped on your Aillio profile and see you also got the Colombia HP Aponte Community... such a great all around bean. What were your Burundi v60 parameters?
I did! Unfortunately I roasted it for the wife (likes darker coffee so I don't worry with curves as much) and did not get to taste any of it with the V60. The extraction data is only for my #2 Burundi roast. Sorry for the data dump I am about to do:

For the first 2 I did 3x weight bloom then 100g pulse pours
2019-06-01
Dose Weight........ 25.5g
Brew Water ......... 375g
Beverage ........... 329g
Measured EXT....... 21.84%
Measured TDS........ 1.64 %
Measured Beverage... 326g
Brew Water Temp..... 96°C
Brewer Type......... Hario
Brew Time........... 3 min 36 sec
Grinder............. EK43
Grind Setting....... 9

2019-06-02
Dose Weight........ 25.5g
Brew Water ......... 408g
Beverage ........... 363g
Measured EXT....... 22.98%
Measured TDS........ 1.58 %
Measured Beverage... 356g
Brew Water Temp..... 96°C
Brewer Type......... Hario
Brew Time........... 3 min 45 sec
Grinder............. EK43
Grind Setting....... 9.5

2019-06-11
Dose Weight........ 25.5g
Brew Water ......... 408g
Measured EXT....... 20.74%
Measured TDS........ 1.41 %
Measured Beverage... 360g
Brew Water Temp..... 97.7°C
Brewer Type......... Hario
Brew Time........... 4 min 0 sec
Grinder............. EK43
Grind Setting....... 9.5

For the next 2 I did 3X weight bloom then a single pour
2019-06-04
Dose Weight........ 25.0g
Brew Water ......... 400g
Beverage ........... 356g
Measured EXT....... 19.34%
Measured TDS........ 1.30 %
Measured Beverage... 357g
Brew Water Temp..... 96°C
Brew Time........... 2 min 45 sec
Grinder............. EK43
Grind Setting....... 10.5?

2019-06-05
Dose Weight........ 24.0g
Brew Water ......... 374g
Beverage ........... 331g
Measured EXT....... 20.34%
Measured TDS........ 1.42 %
Measured Beverage... 330g
Brew Water Temp..... 96°C
Brew Time........... 3 min 15 sec
Grinder............. EK43
Grind Setting....... 9.5

I'll also say this about the Burundi, it seems very tempermental to brew temperature. I tried it today at the last set of variables, only changing to 200 Fahrenheit to try get rid of the roastiness. I almost threw out the coffee because it tasted like nothing. Some of my earlier extractions may even have been at 208 F instead of 205 listed here. I don't have extraction data for the #1 roast of this bean because I did not have my EK at the time. It was more developed than my second roast and contained a lot less florals, but more fruit. It also had spice in it as described by sweet marias.

EDIT (2019-06-11)
Tried another 3x bloom and 100g pulse pours today. Interestingly this one had a lower extraction despite similar brew parameters to a previous attempt. My guess is that earlier brew was much closer to roast and the agitation of the coffee bed even after blooming caused a higher extraction. I also upped my temp to 208f today and it was much better than yesterday.

False1001: I think the lower extractions from an immersion (cupping) are what is killing your flavor descriptors. My best brews with this bean have been hot and highly extracted (21-23% range). Roasty finish has persisted in all my different attempts at brewing. The main descriptors I have for the higher extracted, better tasting brews are: tea-like acidity, simple-sweetness to maybe a light honey sweetness, light blackberry floral fruitiness, and an annoying roasty finish.

crunchybean

#15: Post by crunchybean » Jun 10, 2019, 3:06 pm

I wouldn't throw out the roast, you can gently reroast it dark and then give it to the *$ lover in your life or save it as grinder seasoning. If your really adept you can use those dark roasts as coffee extracts for dessert or stew/chili flavorings, grind them and uses as a face exfoliant instead of the usual colon cleanse or use as compost, plants love coffee grounds.

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PapasCup

#16: Post by PapasCup » Jun 10, 2019, 4:14 pm

(removed)

false1001

#17: Post by false1001 » Jun 11, 2019, 12:58 pm

PapasCup wrote:(removed)
Did the above post break any rules? I thought it was very useful and was interested in replicating it myself...
winslette wrote: False1001: I think the lower extractions from an immersion (cupping) are what is killing your flavor descriptors. My best brews with this bean have been hot and highly extracted (21-23% range). Roasty finish has persisted in all my different attempts at brewing. The main descriptors I have for the higher extracted, better tasting brews are: tea-like acidity, simple-sweetness to maybe a light honey sweetness, light blackberry floral fruitiness, and an annoying roasty finish.


Just brewed the last Burundi roast I mentioned (https://roast.world/r/O2BnNJ1fDWfxaaOj2ywbR) via Chemex, and got a really pleasing result. My first light roast I'm happy with on the Bullet!!! Very similar tasting notes to yours @winslette... tea-like, simple-syrup sweetness. Mine actually tasted slightly underdeveloped in the finish... wish I'd dropped 10-15 seconds later. I think you're exactly right, temp is hugely important with this coffee, which is rough since I'm at altitude and have a hard temp barrier at 204. I'm considering using my espresso machine to dispense the water in order to squeeze another degree or two out, but the Clever cone and a mug are a really tight fit. I'll try grinding a bit finer next time and see what happens.

winslette

#18: Post by winslette » Jun 11, 2019, 1:26 pm

false1001 wrote:Just brewed the last Burundi roast I mentioned (https://roast.world/r/O2BnNJ1fDWfxaaOj2ywbR) via Chemex, and got a really pleasing result. My first light roast I'm happy with on the Bullet!!! Very similar tasting notes to yours @winslette... tea-like, simple-syrup sweetness. Mine actually tasted slightly underdeveloped in the finish... wish I'd dropped 10-15 seconds later. I think you're exactly right, temp is hugely important with this coffee, which is rough since I'm at altitude and have a hard temp barrier at 204. I'm considering using my espresso machine to dispense the water in order to squeeze another degree or two out, but the Clever cone and a mug are a really tight fit. I'll try grinding a bit finer next time and see what happens.
I actually ended at a lower bean temperature than you, although my roast was 15 seconds longer. I like your idea of squeezing more temperature and grinding finer. I keep my kettle for pourovers on the base between pours and have checked the temperature with a thermapen and it holds temp very well. I will say that taking it to the end of 1C does kill florals, but gives an interesting note of cloves.

EDIT: Also, Philip, could you please post a picture of your Burundi roast whole beans and/or the Colombia Aponte? I want to see if your roasts are more even due to the soak you perform.

dale_cooper

#19: Post by dale_cooper » Jun 11, 2019, 11:53 pm

Curious - do you always carry that much heat through dev phase? You're really hitting it fairly hard. Have you tried a light roast where you're starting first crack at an ROR of ~10C and dropping down to 4C by the time you drop?

false1001

#20: Post by false1001 » Jun 12, 2019, 9:38 pm

winslette wrote:Also, Philip, could you please post a picture of your Burundi roast whole beans and/or the Colombia Aponte? I want to see if your roasts are more even due to the soak you perform.
Colombia is at work, i'll take a photo tomorrow. Here's the best Burundi roast. The soak has not resulted in good looking roasts, i'll tell you that.

Image

Still haven't 100% dialed in the Burundi for pourover, and trying to use my Silvia like Rao uses his Decent did not end with good results. But I did discover that the Burundi makes a ridiculously good light roast espresso. Almost tastes like sweet tea. Dove into the Yirga Cheffe as well today, and it was all that I expected and more. Such a delicious pourover, and not at all finicky.
dale_cooper wrote:Curious - do you always carry that much heat through dev phase? You're really hitting it fairly hard. Have you tried a light roast where you're starting first crack at an ROR of ~10C and dropping down to 4C by the time you drop?
Context from the other light roast thread is I was initially worried I was spending too much time in the maillard phase, so the goal here was to drop low, maybe soak, and hit with high heat 2 minutes in to maximize drying time and reduce Maillard percentage to ~40% or less. There are two profiles in the What Is A Light Roast thread where I tried a more traditional profile and I was ending up with weak, bitter, and roasty notes with little or no terroir.