Poor Grinder Burr Manufacturer QC - Page 2

Grinders are one of the keys to exceptional espresso. Discuss them here.
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malachi

#11: Post by malachi »

another_jim wrote:A cafe would put through 20 to 30 pounds of coffee through a grinder in a week, so the burrs would be seasoned before anyone really noticed anything.
Whenever we used to install new Robur burrsets the techs would immediately run 5 lbs of coffee through them (before anything else). Then they would dial in the grind by "feel" (of the grounds on the fingers), run another couple pounds, and repeat as the grind would start to drift. They would do this until they ran about 15lbs through the grinder. That's before a shot was pulled.

Even so, the first shift after this happened was a "hell shift" for whoever was on bar.


PS. A medium volume coffee bar is going to go through 20/30 pounds in a day, not a week. Higher volume bars regularly go through more than 100lbs a day.
"Taste is the only morality." -- John Ruskin

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shadowfax (original poster)

#12: Post by shadowfax (original poster) »

Chris, thanks for the information! It's interesting to note the loops that shops/baristas jump through to deal with crap burrs. Sounds like due diligence in pre-inspecting burrs is something that even buyers of brand new grinders should add to their checklist. It also sounds like even the decent ones need a pretty good wear-in. Out of curiosity, would you say that you've ever seen a flawless burrset out of the box? And if so, did you notice that it seemed to perform better (i.e., maybe the first shift was only a "purgatory" rather than a "hell" shift)?.

Anyone ever thought about having your own burrs milled? Could be an interesting proposition if the right machinist could be found...
Nicholas Lundgaard

Baratza: skilled in the art of grinding
Sponsored by Baratza
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JonR10

#13: Post by JonR10 »

shadowfax wrote:Anyone ever thought about having your own burrs milled? Could be an interesting proposition if the right machinist could be found...
I'm going to start looking into that this week ;)
Jon Rosenthal
Houston, Texas

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RapidCoffee
Team HB

#14: Post by RapidCoffee »

Wow, am I the only one around who has not had burr issues? :wink:

Let's see:
a) Replaced 60mm burrs on a Cunill Brasil, no problems.
b) Replaced 64mm burrs on a TagEx SJ, no problems.
c) Replaced standard 64mm SJ burrs with duranium burrs, no problems (other than a few "stalling" incidents).
d) Replaced 83mm burrs on a "scrap metal" Major, no problems.
e) Tested a brand new Robur in the TGP, right out of the shrink wrap, no problems. (Break in? What break in? We don' need no stinkin' break in! Liked it so insanely much I bought a used Robur for home. No problems there either.)
f) Tested a brand new Macap MXKR for the TGP. I did not care for this grinder as much as the other testers. It's possible this was due to lack of burr seasoning.

Each grinder and burr set was purchased from a different vendor. I'm not trying to invalidate reports of poorly milled burrs, but my experience with commercial grade grinders and replacement burrs has (thus far) been very positive.
John

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malachi

#15: Post by malachi »

shadowfax wrote:Out of curiosity, would you say that you've ever seen a flawless burrset out of the box?
"flawless" is a big word.
I've seen very good ones for sure (the most recent Cimbali set I got required no clean up at all).
"Taste is the only morality." -- John Ruskin

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shadowfax (original poster)

#16: Post by shadowfax (original poster) »

RapidCoffee wrote:Wow, am I the only one around who has not had burr issues? :wink:
John, 2 questions. First, how close did you look at all the burrs you've had? I remember on my first TagEx Super Jolly that the burrs weren't bad either; Other burrs I thought looked good on cursory inspection I found issues with as I started looking closer. Second, would you be willing to carefully reinspect some of your burrs now and compare them to the photography collection I am accumulating?

I think my issue with this QC issue is that it seems to reflect poor craftsmanship on what should be precision parts, as Jon said. It may very well be that there's no difference in the cup between a nearly flawless set and a gummed-up-looking set like the one I have, after they're both seasoned. But I have never done the comparison or read anyone else's comparison; now I am curious to look into this more.
Nicholas Lundgaard

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RapidCoffee
Team HB

#17: Post by RapidCoffee »

shadowfax wrote:John, 2 questions. First, how close did you look at all the burrs you've had? I remember on my first TagEx Super Jolly that the burrs weren't bad either; Other burrs I thought looked good on cursory inspection I found issues with as I started looking closer. Second, would you be willing to carefully reinspect some of your burrs now and compare them to the photography collection I am accumulating?
I did not examine the burrs under magnification, nor did I attempt any macro photography. But I never had reason. In my latest burr replacement (the Major), the difference in pour quality between the old and new burrs was immediately evident.

This is a busy period for me, and I'm not willing to take on any additional projects right now. Apologies and good luck with your investigation.
John

Cerini Coffee & Gifts: official US importer for Olympia Express
Sponsored by Cerini Coffee & Gifts
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erics
Supporter ★

#18: Post by erics »

Wow, am I the only one around who has not had burr issues?
Nope. I've had no grinder burr issues since purchase - 11/05 - probably around 200 lbs of beans and still on original grinding burrs.
Skål,

Eric S.
http://users.rcn.com/erics/
E-mail: erics at rcn dot com