Primacog wrote:I agree and i think his disappointment has to be seen in context to his standard which is the ssp hu for the 80mm class. It makes sense that timemore decided to cater to the most customers demographics by giving a burr set that is more clear than a traditional burr like the italmills but not as clear as the ssp because most wouod use it for dark roasts and value the body component of the taste profile more.

This. His perspective also ignores that the 78S is positioned as an all-around grinder that can do filter and espresso (unlike the HU). Disappointed none of these YT reviewers compared to the SSP cast v2, which seems like the real alternative.

He said another place the Cast where better on basically most aspects, juicier, sweeter etc.

Thanks, I missed that. I feel validated now: I canceled my 78S pledge and was fortunate enough to grab a Zerno in the recent drop (w/ Cast v2 burrs) for my all-around espresso and filter grinding needs.

i mean, it better be a better choice at nearly 3 times the price!

I wonder how the 078/078s combo compares to a single Zerno Z1 with cast. People generally recommend against dual-use, but I've never actually tried it and experienced the issues. Presumably, with higher build quality and lower retention, seems like less of an issue. Although the rotary knocker seems less fussy to me than a magnetic attached chute (although maybe the ionizer solves a lot of that).

fcaico wrote:i mean, it better be a better choice at nearly 3 times the price!

Definitely diminishing returns. And a price difference that had me repeatedly questioning my sanity (esp. given burr size delta). In fact, I still am.

Ultimately I found the Z1 UX super compelling (dial marking orientation and micron size markings, ease of cleaning, feel of all-metal construction) and questioned the ease of the 78S espresso dial range and rotational knocker. Plus, the whole made in the USA thing.

That said, a heart > head purchase. The 78S is stupid good value, regardless of its quirks.

superworrier wrote:I wonder how the 078/078s combo compares to a single Zerno Z1 with cast. People generally recommend against dual-use, but I've never actually tried it and experienced the issues. Presumably, with higher build quality and lower retention, seems like less of an issue. Although the rotary knocker seems less fussy to me than a magnetic attached chute (although maybe the ionizer solves a lot of that).

I considered getting a pair, and probably would have if the espresso range on the 78s seemed better. I was also drawn to the rotational knocker at first but eventually thought it might be annoying (seems like a weird motion).

I actually think a pair of 64/64s is compelling (doesnt seem to have the espresso range issue). One with HU burrs (or the stock 64 burr) for traditional espresso, another with MP for filter and modern espresso. I could see that beating the Zerno with cast $ for $. And it wouldn't be so overbearing on the counter as a pair of 78-size grinders.

Based on everything I've read I think the Cast v2 should be my style for both espresso and filter. But if it's not, the above 64 "downgrade" path is probably the route I'll go.

Debating switching my pledge to a 78 because I don't own an espresso machine at the moment and Hedrick's review of the 78S seems lackluster. I do want to get into espresso in the future though.

Should I buy the 78S and just burr-swap to the turbo burrs until I get an espresso machine, or switch my pledge to the 78?

Philhmartin wrote:I considered getting a pair, and probably would have if the espresso range on the 78s seemed better. I was also drawn to the rotational knocker at first but eventually thought it might be annoying (seems like a weird motion).

I actually think a pair of 64/64s is compelling (doesnt seem to have the espresso range issue). One with HU burrs (or the stock 64 burr) for traditional espresso, another with MP for filter and modern espresso. I could see that beating the Zerno with cast $ for $. And it wouldn't be so overbearing on the counter as a pair of 78-size grinders.

Based on everything I've read I think the Cast v2 should be my style for both espresso and filter. But if it's not, the above 64 "downgrade" path is probably the route I'll go.

It prob depends. For me, I don't really like MP profile but the 078 profile sounds pretty good to me. Some people claim the Zerno pre-breakers and slow feeding auger would make it have superior grind quality to other 64mm grinders, but we can call it speculation for now. I ended up with 078/078s pair, but I wasn't really paying much attention to the Zerno.

Not sure what you mean about 64s not having espresso range issue. I think some espresso range complaints on 078s may be relating to using 078s burrs on the 078 model, which doesn't have the additional markers in the bottom of the range. But I may have missed something since I didn't play close attention to 064s reviews

sofia wrote:Debating switching my pledge to a 78 because I don't own an espresso machine at the moment and Hedrick's review of the 78S seems lackluster. I do want to get into espresso in the future though.

Should I buy the 78S and just burr-swap to the turbo burrs until I get an espresso machine, or switch my pledge to the 78?

Personally I'd go 78S. It will still make good filter, gives you optionality for espresso (both burr and step less) and can eventually take the aturbo 78 burr.

While Lance/Kyle both preferred the 78 and MP burrs, at least the latter said the 78S made better filter than the Ode Gen2 (which for me would prob beat out the MP). In short, until the 78 turbo burrs are out, the 78S on its own will make great filter. I've read at least one review online of folks who preferred the 78S filter (some coffee shop in Asia, can't remember the specifics) and one who wasn't a fan of the 78 (coffee chronicler, who actually raved about the 64S, similar to Sprometheus). Both CC/Sprometheus seem to have a slightly different palate that doesn't prioritize clarity as the be all and end all. At least as I perceive it.