SAB wrote:I actually called Baratza today about the sette. I asked what they could tell me about this grinder, as I'm seriously in the market for an upgrade to my Baratza Vario. This is what they shared with me:

1. Conical grinder. Same size burr set as their current conical line (40mm), so not a Titan replacement.

2. Rollout (ie widespread availability for purchase) expected for this summer.

3. Price point less than Forte.

4. Seems to be intended for espresso. I didn't ask about suitability for brewed applications, as that's irrelevant to me (my Vario will be relegated to that task alone after the upgrade).

Obviously, they were unwilling to share all the specifics until after the debut in Atlanta at the scaa, but they were gracious enough to share these tidbits.

It may not be the upgrade that I'd so hoped for, but I may hold off a bit for a little further info.

I'm surprised they shared that much info. If it's accurate, I'm sadly much less interested.

Although they do refer to multiple new grinders on their blog post. So let the speculation continue until the SCAA unveiling.

canuckcoffeeguy wrote:I'm surprised they shared that much info. If it's accurate, I'm sadly much less interested. But let the speculation continue until the SCAA unveiling.

I was a bit surprised as well. But this was one of the guys I have dealt with over the years, and he was very forthright. I could tell when I asked questions that were a bit too pointed, and tried not to push him to pinpoint exact answers where uncertainty remains.

I was honestly hoping for an eg1 killer...a little less polished in appearance, but killer burr set (Titan class), minimal retention, great single doser, small footprint. I could live with the plastic parts in a form factor that recognizes cabinets as a real world entity, has a motor, and eliminates bump-brush and thwack from the daily routine.

I suspect this is more of a replacement for their current conical line, but perhaps they've found a way to make their conicals compete above their heads, just as their flats perform above their size range class.

I'm now committed to waiting to break in my 500 gm North Roaster (expected arrival mid-late March) BEFORE I commit to the new grinder. But I will definitely save my roaster seasoning beans for inevitable grinder seasoning down the road!

I emailed Kyra today and told her I hoped they would have stock at the SCAA so I could buy one. I was hoping for something a little bigger, I guess, but will probably still pick one up for a little background for customers.

It is unrealistic to expect a titan level hardware at their price point. Larger burrs need significantly more torque, bigger motor is expensive and heavier, and needs larger footprint as well.
The requirements for commercial grinder are not really the same as home grinder. if they can deliver with an espresso specific grinder that punches above its class in terms of cup quality and convenience then they already have a winner, just like the vario.

Well that is an interesting development if true. While that is slightly disappointing I never really expected a full on titan level grinder, but was wishing for something more a long the lines of a larger flat from them at the Forte price point.

However, it does make a lot of sense for them to make an espresso grinder that should hopefully be below the price point of the Vario. I have a Preciso and the grinder is awesome for making espresso, when it works. Just that adjustment ring is not strong enough to stand up to the demands of espresso on a daily basis even for a home user like myself. I cannot tell you the amount of times that I have replaced that adjustment ring. So if they make an espresso grinder that in that price point I think it would be a welcome addition.

Overall, it should be interesting to see how this since it sounds like a line refresh all around not just the introduction of one grinder.

SAB wrote:I was a bit surprised as well. But this was one of the guys I have dealt with over the years, and he was very forthright. I could tell when I asked questions that were a bit too pointed, and tried not to push him to pinpoint exact answers where uncertainty remains.

I was honestly hoping for an eg1 killer...a little less polished in appearance, but killer burr set (Titan class), minimal retention, great single doser, small footprint. I could live with the plastic parts in a form factor that recognizes cabinets as a real world entity, has a motor, and eliminates bump-brush and thwack from the daily routine.

I suspect this is more of a replacement for their current conical line, but perhaps they've found a way to make their conicals compete above their heads, just as their flats perform above their size range class.

I'm now committed to waiting to break in my 500 gm North Roaster (expected arrival mid-late March) BEFORE I commit to the new grinder. But I will definitely save my roaster seasoning beans for inevitable grinder seasoning down the road!

You're not getting an eg killer for cheep, just the burr it self coast more then many entry level grinders, arround $5-600, then you have to add all the other parts including a rigid and massive motor to drive those massive burrs, and then there is still a body to be made of either steel or aluminum plastic won't due as you'll need a massive weight to keep the grinder from moving!, R&D, wages etc. etc. all of this adds up. it will almost be an impossible task to make such a grinder available for the masses. The manufacturing price alone is unfortunately going to be higher then allot of high end conicals and flattburrs allready in production.

There is a reason why an EK43 is so expensive, sure demand has pushed the price even further up, but it where allready more expensive then the majority of espresso grinders even before Perger feld in love with it.

I agree with all the above. Baratza is a GREAT company with exceptional grinders and super customer service.

The missing piece is a higher end espresso specific grinder IMHO. Can't wait to see what they have up their proverbial sleeve.

Judging by their past history, it should be a crowd pleaser.

Burr size isn't everything. Burr design is equally important as we've seen with grinders like the Vario and even K30 which perform exceptionally well considering their smaller burr sizes relative to others in their respective classes.

I'm still hoping technology and design advances to give us commercial quality in the cup in a much smaller footprint, but with less than commercial durability to keep costs down.

Even a well aligned and well designed smaller burrset has it's limitations, like those found in a K30. it is simply put not able to deliver what an EK43 is able to with it's massive 98mm burrs.

While we might see improvements on burr design in the forthcoming future, then I do not believe it is going to narrow the gap more then what has already been achieved, as the bigger burrs are also benefitting from such improvements. And those improvements usually come at a price, as seen with the k30 burrs these are almost 4 times as expensive as 83mm burrs!.

The Vario home is not rigid enough and therefor goes out of calibration and some cases alignment, that kind of build quality would never be able to get the same out of a set of burrs as your not achieving the same rigidness and alignment as with a better and more expensive constructions.

Mahlkonig has also been stating they have no plans on introducing a new product for the home user, leaving any chance for a massive leap forward for dead.

malling wrote:You're not getting an eg killer for cheep, just the burr it self coast more then many entry level grinders, arround $5-600

http://lynweber.com/product/eg-1-burr-set/

I understand your point. Quality comes at a certain cost. However, overstating your case only helps make MY point. Eg1 burrs are $225.

I don't know if:

1. It CAN be done

2. If it could be PROFITABLY done

3. It could RELIABLY be done

To create a grinder with the lower height and smaller footprint, adequate size burrs, and small retention to be useful to the HB community. I don't even care if it's the same price as the k30-compak f10 price range, if it's DESIGNED to integrate better into my space at home.

In flats, the k30 and ceado e37s seem to be filling that bill fairly well, and the eg1 may be the ultimate home solution, but that remains to be seen as they iron out the little details. But there is no conical with a motor designed for that high end home market. Certainly, with mods, many of us have found solutions.

While this Sette will likely be an above average grinder for the price point based on Baratzas other offerings, I was personally hoping that baratza had gone up the ladder a bit farther. How the grinder actually plays is still to be seen, and final results WAY to early to tell.