Macap M7D problem/jamming - Page 2

Grinders are one of the keys to exceptional espresso. Discuss them here.
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slipchuck
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#11: Post by slipchuck »

Wow with an 800 watt motor you would think it would power right through anything you throw at it
Hope you get it figured out

Randy
“There is nobody you can’t learn to like once you’ve heard their story.”

desmond99 (original poster)
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#12: Post by desmond99 (original poster) »

@BP thanks for your comments. Used timed dosing, after burrs wore in it stabilized at 3.25-3.30 sec for 20g. When it jammed, I would adjust significantly coarser until it ran again, but as soon as I adjusted fine enough for espresso (around 5.5 on the collar), it would jam again. Tried many different coffees, the only one that didn't jam was Caffe Vita's Del Sol blend, which looks a little on the darker side to me. I concur with Randy, it really should be able to grind anything. I know that all grinders can jam on occasion, but mine did it constantly, whether single dosed/timed/different beans/full or empty hopper. It's back at Macap now, I will update if they are able to find a solution. I hope so, awesome grinder when it worked.

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jeffdt
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#13: Post by jeffdt replying to desmond99 »

Hey Desmond, were you ever able to get this resolved?

I sent mine back to Clive and they sent me a Eureka Zenith to use for a catering event I had booked in the meantime. Clive was unable to find a problem with my M7D (I believe they said they used it for an event to give it a real field test) and ended up sending it back. I gave it a few quick tests when it got back but since no changes had been made I no longer trusted that grinder so I stopped taking catering gigs.

Cut to today, 3/4 a year later, and I've finally started using it again lightly at home, as I really want to start catering again. It's been performing fine on the last few weeks, but I just switched out to different coffee today and it jammed immediately. I'm inclined to agree with you (desmond) that while using only dark roasts is not a solution, it does seem to indicate that the motor must just barely be generating enough torque to grind a darker roast, and going any lighter increases bean density just enough that the motor cannot perform.

The Zenith performed like a champ using identical coffee that had been jamming with the M7D. I never had a single problem with it. I was actually considering asking if I could just keep it because the thought of having the M7D back was stressing me out despite the M7D costing several hundreds more.

Clive has been very professional and accommodating and I am not trying to place blame on them. I'm just super bummed and feel like I'm stuck with a useless grinder. I've worked in 5 different cafes and have never had a problem operating any of their grinders, but the one I spent my own money on is unusable. I feel confident that it's not user error as I've worked with enough equipment to know what is normal. I (wrongly) assumed that a grinder at this price point would be a safe choice. I wish I had stuck with a more proven brand.

walt_in_hawaii
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#14: Post by walt_in_hawaii »

I don't think its a problem generic to the Macap, or to that model. Sounds like the same thing was happening to me:

Plugged grinder burrs!

and I put in a post under "Plugged Grinder Burrs!"
it happened to my super jolly with a brand new set of SSP burrs, but after a single treatment with oatmeal (maybe 3? or 4 handfuls...) it never happened again. It also happened with another grinder I have, a La Pavoni, again with a brand new set of burrs that I put into it. I took that machine out of service, and have not used it since. The problem seems to involve a very tight grind and the oils somehow causing the grounds to stick into the tight, very last portion of the burrs where the tiny exit holes are. You can see in my photos the darker discoloration of the grounds in that part of the burrs when I took them out to inspect them after it happened to me. Jake, who also has a SJ, had identical problems with his, although his keeps recurring at odd intervals even years later. For me, it has not recurred at all after the initial round of problems right after putting in the new burrs. When inspecting my burrs, I used a wooden toothpick and just scraped the exit circumference, and all the plugged grounds popped out easily... but there WAS a very slight resistance before popping out. That tells me the coffee building up behind the plug would not be able to get out under normal use ... its just not heavy enough to move the plug. It never recurred for me, so I haven't been trying to solve this; but Jake noted that you can back it out to coarse as it happens, and this will prevent it. Perhaps if you swap out the burrs and try another set?

good luck,
walt

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jeffdt
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#15: Post by jeffdt replying to walt_in_hawaii »

Thanks for the input Walt! I don't have another set of burrs handy and I'm hesitant to spend any more money on this grinder given its track record... plus I'm broke :wink: I'll try running some oatmeal through though, it wouldn't hurt. But I find it bizarre that I've never had this problem with another grinder in any of the shops I've worked in, and the same coffee that jammed the M7D never jammed the Zenith that Clive Coffee sent me.

I have taken apart my M7D and carefully cleaned it with a toothpick but it didn't seem to make a difference. It would unjam it for a time but within a few days it was jamming again. Not to mention the crazy amount of coffee I've gone through having to get it back to a reasonable grind setting again after taking it apart. I'm not using any crazy espresso recipe, just using a double basket to do 18g in, 36g out, ~30 seconds. It's able to grind 18g in 3.25 seconds when the thing actually works which seems to be within the settings Clive expects as per their responses in this thread.

I can't be 100% sure but I really feel like I just got shafted with a defective unit. At this point I would gladly eat the price difference to get a working Zenith again. Without a reliable grinder my entire espresso setup is useless.

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jeffdt
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#16: Post by jeffdt »

I decided to roll the dice and take my grinder to a big event. It literally started jamming on the second shot. Suppose that's better than grinding halfway through the event when I could potentially have a line.

I've sent emails to Clive Coffee a few times but never got a reply. It's hard to shake the feeling that I got totally screwed on this purchase.

I was hoping they would allow me to trade it in for a much cheaper grinder (i.e. Eureka Zenith). I'd be more than willing to just cut my losses if I was able to get a working grinder so I could try to recoup my investment by taking catering gigs. But it seems they just want to pretend I don't exist.

So I guess I'm just out $1800? Or can anyone recommend a way to recoup at least some of my investment?

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slipchuck
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#17: Post by slipchuck »

I would try to find out were an authorized repair center or call the factory and see if they will repair it. It might cost a few bucks, but right now you have an $1800 door stop. I would get it repaired and sell it.

Randy
“There is nobody you can’t learn to like once you’ve heard their story.”

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ira
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#18: Post by ira »

It's possibly just a dying or out of spec motor start capacitor. I believe that would cause those symptoms.

Ira

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BaristaBoy E61
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#19: Post by BaristaBoy E61 »

Does your roaster use a de-stoner - might that be the problem?
"You didn't buy an Espresso Machine - You bought a Chemistry Set!"

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jeffdt
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#20: Post by jeffdt »

slipchuck wrote:I would try to find out were an authorized repair center or call the factory and see if they will repair it. It might cost a few bucks, but right now you have an $1800 door stop. I would get it repaired and sell it.
Yeah I would definitely be willing to pay if it meant I could get this thing out of my life and get a fraction of the money back. Honestly I'll probably have trouble selling it even after it's been fixed. It took heavy cosmetic damage shipping it back and forth with Clive. Cosmetics aren't a huge problem for me personally if the thing actually works, but I know it matters to others when buying.
ira wrote:It's possibly just a dying or out of spec motor start capacitor. I believe that would cause those symptoms.

Ira
I've actually been thinking it was a bad capacitor the entire time, but I don't know enough about grinders (or electricity for that matter) to know for sure or how to confirm it. Would a grinder technician likely know how to fix something like that? I do know someone in the area that works on grinders a lot but curious whether this is a common problem he'll have come across. I was planning on getting in touch with him today.
BaristaBoy E61 wrote:Does your roaster use a de-stoner - might that be the problem?
I don't think that's the problem, because I've used the same exact coffee with two other espresso grinders and they both worked 100% of the time. They were both less powerful grinders than mine (in theory).