Lagom P100 - Page 34

Grinders are one of the keys to exceptional espresso. Discuss them here.
sochaux_

#331: Post by sochaux_ »

GorchT wrote:The only two grinders I have read(!) that are quite good with most roasts are the Lab Sweet and the Bentwood. Even though they might have some problems with filter light roasts for espresso. But this is all (sorry for using a german expression): hören sagen. Those are just tips from reading stuff I have no experience with any of the grinders, so I am sorry to be just able to help with stuff I read.
@FluffyGTX In addition to this^^ there are many rumors* about Lab Sweet style burrs (64mm) that should be coming soon(this year at least) from SSP and Option-O. *SSP have already announced it on Instagram and I heard that Option-O announced it on a discord channel.
Lagom P64 + one of these burrs set might be an interesting option for your case. :)

Eiern

#332: Post by Eiern »

Just a heads up that you can ask for different burrs shipped in the P100 other than HU, you just let them know after you buy one, and it's a small fee. Several have ordered with Brew or Low Uniformity now.

level3ninja

#333: Post by level3ninja »

sochaux_ wrote:@FluffyGTX In addition to this^^ there are many rumors* about Lab Sweet style burrs (64mm) that should be coming soon(this year at least) from SSP and Option-O. *SSP have already announced it on Instagram and I heard that Option-O announced it on a discord channel.
Option-O put pictures of theirs on their IG before SSP posted theirs.

FluffyGTX

#334: Post by FluffyGTX »

Eiern wrote:Just a heads up that you can ask for different burrs shipped in the P100 other than HU, you just let them know after you buy one, and it's a small fee. Several have ordered with Brew or Low Uniformity now.
Trying to understand the differences between the burr sets makes me angry and confused ;)
I guess I roughly understood the differences of the 64 mm burrs. The progression "Standard" -> HU -> Unimodel seem to be quite consistently described. There seems to be a progression in clarity a better fit for lighter roasts and decreasing body/mouthfeel.

The 98mm burrs seem to be inconsistently named and I get contradicting statements from "the internet". The HU ones seem more Unimodal. Is there something like equivalent of 64mm HU in 98mm with roughly the same workflow? I would be happy to directly buy a 98mm grinder, but it is challenging to find the right burr set. I also got a hint to take the "low fines" as an all purpose burr set. But who knows?

Lab sweet style burrs also sound interesting. I would really like to go into a shop and try the different burrs. But this is totally unrealistic here in Munich, it seems.

Eiern

#335: Post by Eiern »

It's hard to get info on the different SSP burrs, and they are not very well named or explained, and then grinder manufacturers use their own names for the burrs borrowed from other burr names to confuse even more. And different burr size with same name doesn't mean they behave very similar. Then owners use them with different style of roasts and preperation methods.

I have tasted HU, Brew and ULF quite a bit as I own all three sets, also tried LU briefly side by side with my Brew and ULF + new EK burrs recut to pre 15-ish/Cast finishing section by SSP.

HU is the most traditional espresso burr in presentation and ratio, can do a clear enough and punchy espresso from light filter roast and with darker roasts it can do very tight ratios too from what I've read. It is unimodal with plenty fines, does good filter but not as nice filter as LU or Brew to me as it's a little more noisy/aggressive. I find them a little too much as espresso too and have them in their box and just use them sometimes for fun but quickly grow tired of their presentation personally. I find them a bit intense, with some of the aggressive or bitter noisy notes in every brew giving a more generic coffee presentation.

Ultra Low Fines is my favorite burr for less traditional espresso, it does very nice 1:3 espresso from nordic filter roast, ~25 sec with my machine. It has LU inner sections with Ditting machined burrs finishing section, U-shaped instead of sawtooth edges. Balanced, clear (enough) aromas with a nice mouthfeel. It doesn't seem noisy and lacking bitter notes, more gentle but blended. With 1:3 they extract high, and the beans need to be good to handle it or you expose defects or roast, if bitter balanced from roast just cut it tighter and get a balanced shot. If defects but not balanced too bad. It's good for filter but not as clear in presenting aromas as HU or Brew, but a well extracted blended cup, often sweet and with nice body.

LU is good at espresso and filter. Brew can make espresso but it's a little extra clean and less mouthfeel, it's a little similar to a HU but cleaned up. It is identical to HU inner sections but outer section is a little different and deeper fallout for les fines creation and a little more particle spread. Very similar to a pre 15 EK burr, but machined first section.

For a balanced espresso with the same bean I'd go a little over 1:2 with HU and 1:3 with ULF and the LU and Brew would sit somewhere in between. That's because they probably have a little more spread in particles and probably a little less fines so they extract a little difference. But it's all flat big SSP burrs so they are still all precision, extract high, fast flow as the shot progresses, no boulders. By the way I use 86C temp with all these burrs with soft water.

I prefer them all to my stock new EK burrs, which are decent enough but fall short compared to these in my opinion. The SSP burrs are probably best for clarity, if that's not the most important aspect, maybe other burrs would be better. I like clarity so I can really taste the bean, but want some complexity and mouthfeel too. I'm very happy with SSP 98 Brew for filter and 98 Ultra Low Fines for espresso.
★ Helpful

Eiern

#336: Post by Eiern »

Low Fines was used a while for the Low Uniformity burrs, but that is not the Ultra Low Fines, often called just Ultra. The 64 HU are said to be a bit more old school and toward some conicals even, and the 64 Multi Purpose (64 Brew tweaked for espresso) is maybe more similar to High Uniformity, and all 98mm burrs seem to be toward that kind of fast flow unimodal style of those.

SSP called the 64 burrs Espresso, Option-O called them High Uniformity. SSP called the other 64mm burrs Brewing, Option-O called them Unimodal. If I recall correctly.

FluffyGTX

#337: Post by FluffyGTX »

Wow, that really helped. But somehow I get the impression that the 64mm might be a better pick for me and my wife. I am really a big fan of reproducing the characteristics of the bean.
Eiern wrote:I like clarity so I can really taste the bean, but want some complexity and mouthfeel too.
I can totally agree on that. Since I try to address both worlds and the "more unimodal, fast flowing" workflow would not go well with my wife, I somehow think to buy the 64mm grinder with HU & Unimodal burr sets (Option O naming) would fit better.

I would have to think about if and how to "sell" the faster flowing workflows here at home ;)
What seems to be in favour of the 98mm burrs is the ability to push further in regards of bean characteristics and you maybe have less need for RDT. But 64 burrs seem to be able to also work quite well, even if not all the way.

cmin

#338: Post by cmin »

Eiern wrote:It's hard to get info on the different SSP burrs, and they are not very well named or explained, and then grinder manufacturers use their own names for the burrs borrowed from other burr names to confuse even more.
Yeah I fully agree there and I had SSPs before lol. Its way confusing now and makes 0 sense, and than companies have their own interpretation, and than users have their own interpretation of those interpretations what should be used for. Someone will say I make X coffee, oh you need this, someone else no you need this burr, someone else no neither of those should be using this SSP blah blah blah lol. Back when I bought SSP for SJ years ago there was none of that, was just SSP, thats it, not a dozen different burrs and various interpretations.

mreloc
Supporter ♡

#339: Post by mreloc »

Has anyone gotten any insight into when the P100 may be available? The last update on the website was from last November. I've sent them an inquiry 4 days ago and I have not received any response (which I find a bit strange from a customer service perspective)

zero610

#340: Post by zero610 » replying to mreloc »

It's Chinese New Year so everything over there is basically shut down. A few days ago, they responded with sometime in March when the next set will probably ship out. Hopefully that's true.