Hiku: The Premium Hand Coffee Grinder (Kickstarter) - Page 2

Grinders are one of the keys to exceptional espresso. Discuss them here.
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jbviau

Postby jbviau » Dec 11, 2017, 1:03 pm

Just noticed that a different video on their Kickstarter page explicitly compares the Hiku to a LIDO in what I'd consider an unfair and unprofessional manner. :roll:
"It's not anecdotal evidence, it's artisanal data." -Matt Yglesias

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sweaner

Postby sweaner » replying to jbviau » Dec 11, 2017, 1:22 pm

If it turns out to be true I see no problem with it. We shall see.
Scott
LMWDP #248

www.coffeefreek.com

renatoa

Postby renatoa » Dec 11, 2017, 1:53 pm

CwD wrote:How is cramming all the grind settings in 80° a feature? Just gonna make it harder to make small adjustments than grinders that may require several full rotations.


For Feldgrind I have a similar small range from espresso to brew, about 120 degrees (4 of 12 divisions). It all depends on the screw step. Feld and Kinu have 0.5mm, this H(a)iku :) could have 0.75, as some Kinu iterations.
With this assumption 80 degrees could equate 120 degrees in terms of burrs distance.

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instantkamera

Postby instantkamera » Dec 12, 2017, 11:19 am

CwD wrote:How is cramming all the grind settings in 80° a feature? Just gonna make it harder to make small adjustments than grinders that may require several full rotations.


This seems like a brew-centric grinder that can do espresso grind (but like the non E Lido, it's adjustment isn't really tailored for it. Waiting to be proven wrong here. Also, they claim to have not used a Chinese burr manufacturer, but the design isn't far off what's already out there. The Helor chinese burr is less suitable for espresso than the Italmill.

jbviau wrote:^^^ Agreed. On the KS page they talk about non-linear ramping re: the adjustment mechanism, but still.

Concerning what else is supposed to make this thing unique, Knock grinders use a spring as well (though not a wave spring, if that actually matters).


The Helor also uses a spring. In fact, I was surprised to find out this isn't a universal design trait. Nonetheless, their claim is specifically regarding "wave spring", not that they are the only grinder with a spring.

sweaner wrote:If it turns out to be true I see no problem with it. We shall see.


But it's not true. The Lido isn't "slow" by any definition of hand grinding, not to mention that targeting them directly is a pretty classless move.

renatoa wrote:Faster but more effort. Was been seen/felt with Kinu ;)


I think this bears repeating. We all know there's no magic here: you want to grind faster, you need more force. Increase in burr size comes with a penalty, which can only be overcome by gearing (easier to turn, but slower to grind again). This thing is huge and seems like it would be difficult to grip by anyone with small hands. The two videos I have seen show that; the person grinding in all cases appears to have a death grip on the grinder (which I find even with my Helor).

I'm Canadian, I'd love to support the project (and the price is right if the game they talk is real), but I'd like to see a bit more transparency with the community at large.

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sweaner

Postby sweaner » Dec 12, 2017, 11:43 am

instantkamera wrote:But it's not true. The Lido isn't "slow" by any definition of hand grinding, not to mention that targeting them directly is a pretty classless move.


The Lido is slower than a Pharos. maybe this new grinder is as fast as a Pharos, making the Lido "slow." This is advertising.
Scott
LMWDP #248

www.coffeefreek.com

thecoffeefield

Postby thecoffeefield » Dec 12, 2017, 12:16 pm

I don't think the comparison is classless, it's advertising/marketing. They are trying to sell a manual grinder that they claim to be better, faster and precise and so they are comparing it to a popular manual grinder and highlighting what they think are deficiencies in the competitor's model. The project was fully funded so soon enough the backers will have the actual product and I'm sure all sort of comparisons will be available then.

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instantkamera

Postby instantkamera » Dec 12, 2017, 12:20 pm

sweaner wrote:The Lido is slower than a Pharos. maybe this new grinder is as fast as a Pharos, making the Lido "slow." This is advertising.


Slower != Slow. The Lido, when compared to most grinders in this class, is actually on the faster end of things. This is just plain disingenuous. If it's as fast as a Pharos, show *that* (my hunch is that it is not).

Just because it's marketing doesn't mean that:

A) they have to lie
or
B) I have to like it

You can frame it however you like, but in the end they are making a niche product marketed to a segment that exists partly because of OE. Seems a bit out of touch.

doelauw

Postby doelauw » Dec 12, 2017, 12:38 pm

instantkamera wrote:You can frame it however you like, but in the end they are making a niche product marketed to a segment that exists partly because of OE. Seems a bit out of touch.


Totally agree! Would be nice if they make up for this in one way, not sure how :-).

thecoffeefield

Postby thecoffeefield » Dec 12, 2017, 12:54 pm

instantkamera wrote:
Just because it's marketing doesn't mean that:

A) they have to lie
or
B) I have to like it



They can't be lying, yet, because the product is not out and you haven't used it. Once you play with it and you find it slower than the Lido then we can say they are lying. Also, they didn't say that you or anyone has to like it, they simply picked a competitor and in a video, compared their product to the competitor's. Seems reasonable to me. I'm not affiliated with them in any way, just a backer on Kickstarter.

Also, not sure how manual grinders were pioneered/created by OE? Manual coffee grinders have been out there since late 19th century.

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jbviau

Postby jbviau » Dec 12, 2017, 1:40 pm

See here for some light Twitter discussion of a few apparent inaccuracies.
"It's not anecdotal evidence, it's artisanal data." -Matt Yglesias