Gevi Grindmaster? - Page 7

Grinders are one of the keys to exceptional espresso. Discuss them here.
Jonk
Posts: 2101
Joined: 4 years ago

#61: Post by Jonk »

The P64 has always been the same price directly from Option-O AFAIK:

Lagom P64 Flat (Option-O)

Anyway, I don't see the need to exaggerate or undervalue the "GGM". Seems fine for what it is (neither Zerno nor P64) and perhaps what I'd hoped either the Ode or Timemore 064 to be, both grinders that would've benefited from more torque (at least for low rpm / espresso)

malling
Posts: 2843
Joined: 12 years ago

#62: Post by malling »

Capuchin Monk wrote:If my memory serves, Lagom P64 had early bird price of roughly half during the promotion period, no? Gevi is doing the same thing.
I truly doubt it realistically will ever sell at that fictional resale price, it look mostly to be level at sculpture grinders at the very best. It's adjustment mechanism is 85% ripoff of Ode and on that it massively flawed for finer grinding.

Comparing it with p64 seem a huge stretch to say the least.

They price this equal to the mazzer do you really realistically think they can hold that price, I'll say that is never realistic going to happen if they actually want to sell a single grinder.

Capuchin Monk
Posts: 1192
Joined: 14 years ago

#63: Post by Capuchin Monk »

malling wrote:on that it massively flawed for finer grinding.
That's already been improved upon by updating the adjustment thread from 1mm to 0.5mm.
Comparing it with p64 seem a huge stretch to say the least.
Kick start price idea was compared, not the mechanics. I did bring up Zerno and Nautilus for the similarity of mechanical configurations.
They price this equal to the mazzer do you really realistically think they can hold that price, I'll say that is never realistic going to happen if they actually want to sell a single grinder.
That is to be seen.

malling
Posts: 2843
Joined: 12 years ago

#64: Post by malling »

Capuchin Monk wrote:That's already been improved upon by updating the adjustment thread from 1mm to 0.5mm.
It wasn't what I referred too, let me elaborate on it, the design of the chamber, carrier etc. caused retention over time if you did fine grinding, given dose inconsistency due to some of that occasionally finding its way into the dose. This grinder is build on that to a very high degree, and that design is flawed for fine grinding. Making a finer pitch and make it steeples is all good but it isn't changing the issue with said design. Some of the first reviewers also find grinds buildup on this but it was before latest versions, hopefully the did necessary modifications so this is fixed, but honestly I'm sceptical but time will tell with first user reviews and not paid reviews.
Kick start price idea was compared, not the mechanics. I did bring up Zerno and Nautilus for the similarity of mechanical configurations.


That is to be seen.
The original price of Lagom p64 was 1475$ with a 600$ deposit today it's 1585$ so it never had a discount. Zerno had a slight early version discount of a couple of hundred because it wasn't a fully released version.

Neither where crowdfunding, crowdfunding is no guarantee and entirely build on trust and is high risk, why you usually get large discounts, unfortunately that discounts is often exaggerated as resale prices often show not to be as advertised.

While I'm sure it's a perfect fine product, I just think people should be a little more sceptical about it. This product is after all not made by a well respected manufacturer but rather some unknown Chinese factory that might or might not have experience. The indiegogo price is fine for whst is likely the product the problem I'm raising is the rated MSRP that seem rather excessive especially knowing Mazzer launches a product there and we all know their product are build like tanks. My point is I simply don't see market if they try selling it at price of a well established and renowned manufacturer, it needs to be competitive priced.

Jonk
Posts: 2101
Joined: 4 years ago

#65: Post by Jonk »

malling wrote:original price of Lagom p64 was 1475$
Sorry to nitpick, but that was with the inexpensive burrs that are no longer offered. It's exactly the same price with SSP burrs now as it was at launch.

It is a valid point that MSRP is often inflated in Kickstarter campaigns.

Capuchin Monk
Posts: 1192
Joined: 14 years ago

#66: Post by Capuchin Monk »

malling wrote:This product is after all not made by a well respected manufacturer but rather some unknown Chinese factory that might or might not have experience.
The same can be said about almost all single dose grinders these days.

malling
Posts: 2843
Joined: 12 years ago

#67: Post by malling replying to Capuchin Monk »


But majority of companies like this didn't truly launch a 1k product as their first grinder projects, whatever the type of company this is. Reality is that this isn't a bunch of coffee geeks who came together and jumped into the deep and tried too launch the ultimate grinder and revolutionise the home market , this is some odd sort of home appliance company of what seem to be Chinese origin with a western address who noticed a growing market, in that they have more in common with Turin and their countless of different names. Even Chinese Timemore who is well established company by now didn't launch a 1k grinder as their first.

We already know this product exists by a different name, this is just an upgraded version, it's not a unique new product. In that it's very different to that of Kafatek, Option-O, Titus, Weber and Acaia and how they approach this.

This is a masses produced product and obviously should be priced as such. They fact they can sell it at nearly 50% really if anything tell you what it is, a cheap to produce mass produced item.

I'm not saying anything wrong with that, but I do generally anticipate it to be reflected in launch price, hopefully they massively inflated MSRP and it will never reflect the actual price.

But view might vary... I do think we are not going any further and are repeating ourselves so I'll end it here

Capuchin Monk
Posts: 1192
Joined: 14 years ago

#68: Post by Capuchin Monk »

malling wrote:It wasn't what I referred too, let me elaborate on it, the design of the chamber, carrier etc. caused retention over time if you did fine grinding, given dose inconsistency due to some of that occasionally finding its way into the dose. This grinder is build on that to a very high degree, and that design is flawed for fine grinding. Making a finer pitch and make it steeples is all good but it isn't changing the issue with said design. Some of the first reviewers also find grinds buildup on this but it was before latest versions, hopefully the did necessary modifications so this is fixed, but honestly I'm sceptical but time will tell with first user reviews and not paid reviews.
I was doing a forum search on rollermill when it was brought up on other grinder thread and stumbled onto this thread which shows (second image) that even Mahlkonig (reputable company that's been around for a long time) has the same retention issue. :shock:

malling
Posts: 2843
Joined: 12 years ago

#69: Post by malling replying to Capuchin Monk »

As I said known issues with that design, with Titus carrier much of the retention there was removed, on Ode not so much, additionally there where other places on Ode where ground find a way to hide.

I find that the Sculpture, Philos, Zerno and Titus Nautilus/Nimbus is a much better design in terms of retention. I look forward to how DF83V look inside hopefully it dos not use the EK43 design!

Capuchin Monk
Posts: 1192
Joined: 14 years ago

#70: Post by Capuchin Monk »

malling wrote: not use the EK43 design!
Hopefully not. https://community.baristahustle.com/t/m ... fines/2191