G-IOTA / DF64 espresso grinder - Page 69

Grinders are one of the keys to exceptional espresso. Discuss them here.
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#681: Post by DamianWarS »

STG wrote:If you installed SSP unimodal in DF64/G-iota, and did the same with the Ode and compared them, would there really be that much difference in the cup for filter brew like v60?

I'm trying to settle on a filter brew grinder in this price range. I'm also kind of curious about flat burr espresso but I really think I'm more of a medium dark espresso guy. So that's less of a factor for me vs the Niche.
both say their RPM is 1400 but the Ode has less power with a 140w motor over the 250w of the DF64 which is probably why at finer settings the Ode struggles with SSP burrs installed and maybe the real reason why Fellow installed this locking burr set (so you don't go too fine and watch the device struggle) but that can be debated. the DF64 also has a bellows and as much as Hoffmann seems to dislike it, they do work and it's something the Ode does not have. Grinders like the mazzer mini also has a 250w motor like the DF64 and has an RPM of 1600 (plus 2-3 times the price). the SSP burrs could also fit the mazzer mini and it could perhaps produce a similar grind but it is famous for grind retention and you lose the calibration when you open it up (it's also threaded in the burr chamber and coffee gets jammed all up in the threads which Hoffmann mentioned and was probably talking about the mazzer and mazzer copies). I think the DF64 was just paying attention to how people are modding their grinders (like with bellows) and what's wrong with others (like the Mazzer's threading problem) and did a no-frills one, with the exception of course to the font used for grind adjustment. The grinder works well and is good value.

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Sponsored by ECM Manufacture

#682: Post by Sooster »

mikelipino wrote:Soorya, that's awesome. I didn't realize that the flapper as well as the housing was available to print. Once I get my grinder I'll definitely print these out. Question for you, what material did you print the flapper from? Based on the surface quality of the picture, it looks like PLA. Have you tried a flex filament like TPU? It might be better suited for flapper duty.

Edit: Rereading through your post, did you design the flappers? If so well done! This also opens up another possibility. We could use your design to cast the flapper in silicone. I've done it before for a Robot gasket that I was testing, and it's a fun design. Just take your part and use it as a tool to make negatives on a top and bottom surface of blocks (with a few holes to allow for spillage). Take the print, coat it in a mix of dish detergent and water (as a setting and release agent), fill with food grade silicone, squish and let it set for a few hours. It can be much easier than printing directly in very flexible materials, and it's more food-safe.
Hey Mike! Yup, my girlfriend and I designed and printed them (she's much more of an engineer than me haha). I like your ideas! It is printed from PLA+. I've heard that TPU isn't the most food safe, and the grinds do come out fairly warm (even hot at the tight end of the grinding scale). I'm not too sure if this would be an issue, honestly, I think printing with TPU on an Ender 3 Pro might be the bigger challenge! Silicone molds is a great thought too, will definitely look into it. My wonder is if silicone teeth would provide enough resistance to break up larger clumps.

Looks like the thingiverse link already got almost 500 downloads so I'm excited to see how people's experiences with it are. Seems like Caffe Martella had a similar idea (though the video suspiciously came out a few hours after we posted our designs haha!). It is interesting to see how big of a difference the ambient climate/humidities make on static (Singapore vs Minnesota)! If they are reading, truthfully I've had much better success with the "toothed" designs as opposed to the "window pane"-like shapes, as it seems to provide a better clumping/static balance.

For my workflow, I mostly grind directly into the portafilter (deep Cafelat robot basket makes this a breeze) and the grinds are so incredibly fluffy/clump free. WDT is mostly a habit/neuroticism/puck leveler (again paired with SSP high uniformity burrs). This also makes the static mostly a non-issue with an RDT squirt before-hand, though understandably this is less hands-free than can be. Still infinitely better and faster than hand grinding! I do have one of those funnels on the way from amazon, so I'm excited to see how that pairs with the new flaps + normal dosing grinder + standard holding forks. I have noticed that some grinds like to settle in the bottom part of the chute and that they DON'T come out with bellowing - tapping the chute is much more effective to release the last .1-.2 g.


#683: Post by Sooster »

Also, anybody with a LeverCraft Ultra try their bellows on the DF64? Seems like it could be a pretty cool feature add:

https://levercraftcoffee.com/collection ... 1-delivery


#684: Post by tommy2gs »

mtbizzle wrote:Note the 64mm unimodal and Unimodal multipurpose SSP burrs are FAST flow burrs, the same style as the 98mm SSP high uniformity burrs. Many will say, these do not work especially well/perform their best, with the flow rate (time) that you use e.g. with a conical. Many will say with a lot of conviction that these burrs are suited for turbo shots and much faster flow than the "18 in 36 out in 30 seconds" idea.

If you have giota with multipurpose burrs, try fast flow turbo shots - eg closer to 3-4mL/s after fast preinfusion, rather than half that flow rate. Chasing a "normal" flow rate shot arguably will lead to grinding much too fine, and frustration

https://strivefortone.com/2020/09/19/lo ... -espresso/
Wow this is really interesting and I appreciate you sharing this link. I could use some numbers to shoot for in trying to change my shot to this style and see what the results are. Does it sound right to grind coarser until I can pull something like

Goal: 15g in/45gout
Method: 5 seconds Preinfusion ramping up to 3 bars, then increase pressure to 6 bars and end the shot when I'm at a 2.5:1 ratio? Then keep grinding coarser until this takes <20 seconds?

I've never heard of this kind of shot so if there are any high quality YT videos explaining this style that would be awesome.


#685: Post by mikelipino »

Soorya, how's the pairing of the DF64 with Unimodal burrs and the Robot? Have you pulled any shots of varying roast levels? And how have the shots pulled and turned out? Sorry for all the questions, you'll be me in about a month when I get my DF64! Except I'm starting with the Italmil burrs. I assume it will be a step up from the 1ZPresso conical I'm currently using, and it will give me time to decide whether to go with unimodal burrs for light roast espresso + pour over or high uniformity for more classic and pressure profiled espresso.

Oh and I believe the stock clump crusher is silicone, right? Should fit right in.


#686: Post by Jonk »

DamianWarS wrote:Grinders like the mazzer mini also has a 250w motor like the DF64 and has an RPM of 1600
Depends on what frequency the mains are at. In the countries we live in it should spin at 1400rpm and it actually has low retention for a traditional grinder, with an accessible chute so you can achieve near zero. I was apprehensive about stalling before but so far so good.

Have anyone experienced stalling on their DF64? I remember reading about clogged chutes earlier in this thread.

Mike, you can also try 15s shots at your preferred ratio without pre-infusion.


#687: Post by LObin » replying to Jonk »

Clogged chutes are mainly an issue when upgrading to SSP burrs, if no modifications has been made to the flapper. Removing one of the 2 silicone layers of the flapper seems like the easiest solution to clogging but there are other mods available as well.

I've clogged the Italmill TiN burrs when grinding ultra fine (almost Turkish powder). It totally choked my Londinium so I don't think it's an issue for anyone with a G-iota in it's stock configuration.

I'm going to put the N.S Mythos one clump crusher on mine when I get my SSP MP burrs.
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#688: Post by mtbizzle »

(context: 64mm SSP multi-purpose burr = fast flow burrs, suited for fast flow Cameron/Hendon "turbo" espresso, especially w light roast)

Hmm I will try to think of videos. James made a video after their paper was published. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BoYBLn9hRqs I inagine if you looked around YouTube you could find videos of Hendon talking about it at conferences or interviews.

Here is an example of a ~2:1 ratio light roast turbo shot, as an example. The guy this is from, he pulls shots just like this, 2-2.5 ratio, more shots than not. (The key with a lot of these, if the charts are not easy to grasp, is flow is high, often 3-4, not 1.5-2, and pressure is low, 6ish not 9). These two like a fast preinfusion, and a quick "bloom" (drop flow after the preinfusion to let the puck saturate some). I'm not saying all of that is necessary for turbo espresso, just trying to decode the charts a bit if they are obscure.

Here are other examples of turbo profiles, with light roast, with fast flow burrs. Just to illustrate the general approach.

The inventor of this approach is on the "EAF" discord, name StriveForTone https://discord.gg/espresso


#689: Post by Rob_in_Tokyo »

Giampiero wrote:Hi Robert, but how do you know the problem is the board and not the switch or the motor?
Just my 2 cents thought.
Actually I don't know - The manufacturer just assumed it was the board and sent me both a new switch and circuit board...

If this doesn't fix it and I'm stuck with a 500 usd paperweight I'll let people here know.

Appreciate the thought though


#690: Post by Giampiero » replying to Rob_in_Tokyo »

Ok, i mentioned even the motor to not exclude any possibility, but if they sent to you even the switch i think you should be ok...apart the hassle.
For sure i will use this "unlucky" experience to not reinstall the new parts with soldering, i will instead use some sort of connector, for the simple reason that you can easily swap the parts one by one to realize in effect which one was the faulty one, and eventually keep the good one as spare as well.