Best upgrade for Mazzer Mini doser - Page 3

Grinders are one of the keys to exceptional espresso. Discuss them here.
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Jaroslav
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#21: Post by Jaroslav »

Don't let anyone with DF64 tell you anything about the motor in a Mazzer Mini. Both are powered with a 250W motor. I've had SSP HU in my Mini B since May, ground easily over 10kg of coffee through and it has never stalled, not once. I'm grinding light dense beans for espresso, I've never felt like the grinder needs any more power (or anything else really) than it has.

Please keep the Mini and convert it with 64mm carriers, buy and align some nice burrs and please enjoy the rest of it's lifespan. Throwing shade at the potential of the Mini is sad. Selling a Mazzer to buy a chinese grinder is also sad. I'm sure someone will snap back at me with something mean, but in my opinion based on my experience with a few Minis (with SSPs, SJ burrs, standard burrs...) they deserve a certain gratitude. Give it some care, it will pay off in the long run.
Jaroslav

Belbo (original poster)

#22: Post by Belbo (original poster) »

Jaroslav wrote: Don't let anyone with DF64 tell you anything about the motor in a Mazzer Mini. Both are powered with a 250W motor. I've had SSP HU in my Mini B since May, ground easily over 10kg of coffee through and it has never stalled, not once. I'm grinding light dense beans for espresso, I've never felt like the grinder needs any more power (or anything else really) than it has.

Please keep the Mini and convert it with 64mm carriers, buy and align some nice burrs and please enjoy the rest of it's lifespan. Throwing shade at the potential of the Mini is sad. Selling a Mazzer to buy a chinese grinder is also sad. I'm sure someone will snap back at me with something mean, but in my opinion based on my experience with a few Minis (with SSPs, SJ burrs, standard burrs...) they deserve a certain gratitude. Give it some care, it will pay off in the long run.
Thanks a lot for sharing! How would you compare the jump from standard to SJ burrs and from SJ burrs to SSP?

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Jaroslav
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#23: Post by Jaroslav replying to Belbo »

If you mean standard 64mm 189D in the Mini and 033M the Super Jolly, there's a noticable difference in taste. 033M burrs grind faster, the flavour profile is in my opinion very similar but less sharp. The 033M burrs compared to SSP HU burrs - SSP burrs produce more pronounced and cleaner tasting cups with about the same mouthfeel as the 033M. I don't mean to say that Mini's 64mm 189D burrs are bad or boring, they're very good but the jump from these to 033M is really noticable in the cup and jump to SSP HU is significant. My Mini B with HU burrs is what I consider my endgame. But I also have a Mini A with stock burrs and I can tell right away that the stock burrs aren't producing as balanced and predictable shots as the HU burrs. Shots with stock burrs represent acidity in a very sharp way, where as HU burrs are nicely smooth and fruity. The 033M are closer to HU burrs in that regard. The stock burrs shine with medium/medium-dark roast.

When it comes to the 58mm burrs - I've had coffee from the doser as well, but it's hard to judge as the burrs were old and I don't know what they taste like when they're new.

Also, keep in mind that Mazzer makes new burrs for Super Jollys - 233M. I haven't tried these yet but allegedly they're slightly better than the older 033M version. But this sort of shows you the door you'll open with the 64mm burr carrier and how much you can achieve with the grinder.
Jaroslav

palica

#24: Post by palica »

Jaroslav wrote:Also, keep in mind that Mazzer makes new burrs for Super Jollys - 233M. I haven't tried these yet but allegedly they're slightly better than the older 033M version. But this sort of shows you the door you'll open with the 64mm burr carrier and how much you can achieve with the grinder.
Correct, and the 033 is not listed on Mazzer website anymore, except for the titanium version, so I guess the 233 is definitely the new 033. A lot of Mazzer resellers call it the 033M/233M which adds to the confusion. I think they have some old stock of 033 and once sold, they will ship the 233.
From the information I could collect on different forums, it seems the 233M is closer to an SSP Red Speed but I have not seen/red any side by side comparison. One thing is sure: the 033 and the 233 are good burrs with excellent value.

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Jaroslav
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#25: Post by Jaroslav »

palica wrote:One thing is sure: the 033 and the 233 are good burrs with excellent value.
I wanted to come back just to say this. You don't really need to buy SSP burrs right away, 033M burrs are really good. SSP burrs are worth the investement when you get really specific as to what cup you're chasing.
Jaroslav

drH
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#26: Post by drH »

Just to add one more data point if it's helpful- I'm running a super jolly with the new 233M burrs. I have never used the previous iterations but I am enjoying the results a lot. I drink medium to med-dark roasts and it's been a joy to use. I've read in several places that does make a noticeable difference if you can get the SJ burrs into the Mini.
I found this video informative and the presenter was quite impressed with the taste from the burrs in new SJ VPro.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-sc9m3J3g0

nahau

#27: Post by nahau »

I upgraded my mini awhile ago to SJ 64mm burrs and carriers. I have never experienced a stall with my machine and grind time is at least 30% faster than with 58mm burrs.. Can't remember which model OEM burrs I purchased, but the info I wanted to give you is where I purchased the items from. Not sure if you've heard of them, but visit The Espresso Shop UK. They stock the burr carriers and burrs if you want OEM and shipping via DHL was very good considering I live in Hawaii..

https://www.theespressoshop.co.uk

Makanmata

#28: Post by Makanmata »

Belbo wrote:Thanks for sharing your story. The thing with the Mazzer is that you're spoiled with the quality and reliability and it becomes difficult to replace it. Something you might want to try is regularly clean the grinder: it makes a big difference: what I do is disconnect, disassemble, use a vacuum cleaner to get red of the coffer stuck on the walls and also clean the coffee stuck on the burrs. You're right that it seems there are a lot of new things hitting the market and it's worth waiting for them to develop instead of running after the forums favorite that in a couple of years nobody is going to remember.
This is exactly my feeling. To "upgrade" from a 20kg commercial machine that will do its job forever to a plastic domestic device intended for people's homes - and to wait in line for the privilege - just seems wrong. I'm going to try to make the commercial equipment work for me, and I'm now pretty confident that it can be done at a much smaller cost.

As for cleaning, I must say that I was pretty shocked when I opened my machine with a burr that hadn't been changed in over 8 years and it was quite the sh** show. One clear shortcoming of the design of the Mini (which wouldn't have mattered very much in a coffee shop setting for which it was designed) is that there is a large gap of several millimeters between the burr holder and the edges of the space in which it sits - a perfect place to catch wayward grounds. This is a limitation to converting the machine to zero retention.

I have my new 58mm burr working well now and its made a real difference in the cup. I will install the Daniel Wong kit, but I can see that the only way around the gap is to fill it with a 64mm burr holder. Given the raves over the upgraded Super Jolly burr, I'm thinking that my next step is to pick up the 64mm burr holders and go through that exercise too. If I can get retention to around 1g/dose, I can't see how I won't be way ahead of the game.

palica

#29: Post by palica »

Everybody agree that Mazzer grinders are build like a tank and will last for ever (almost). The problem is that it looks like a tank too, and putting it in a kitchen can be questionnable in term of design. Also, Mazzer's are designed as commercial grinders, and converting it to a single dose may not be the best solution. A used Mazzer mini Timer will cost around 200$. If you add the cost of burr holder (150/200$), 64 mm burrs (200$ for SSP, 50$ For Mazzer) and Daniel Wong kit (200$ +), you end up with product with excellent grinding capabilities, which still looks like a tank but with some Harley chrome, with high retention and, at the end, very high cost. It will last for ever, which means you will have a tank for ever on your kitchen counter :mrgreen:
My Mazzer is in the sub-basement, 100% stock and unmodified, close to my roaster, and is used for the purpose it has been designed for: grinding bags of coffee beans for friends who do not have a grinder.

Pressino

#30: Post by Pressino »

I converted my Mini and SJ (both with 64mm burrs...189D in Mini and 33m in SJ) to the single dose DW mod (price about $140 each...not sure of current prices, and this mod made a great improvement in espresso extractions. The Mazzer doser machines are simply terrible when it comes to retention and grind clumping, and you really need vigorous WDT to get rid of clumps. The problem is even worse with dark roasts. The DW mod requires a bit of finagling with the blower and tapping on the chute with a small wooden mallet, but it does make retention very small. Converting the Mini from 58 to 64mm burrs also goes a long way to reducing retention, another reason for doing that. I did use 33M burrs in the Mini for a while and never had a stall, but switched to 189D's to eliminate that possibility. The only real difference I could detect between the 189D and 33M in the Mini was that the 189D's ground a bit slower than the 33M's. There may be slight differences in taste due to relative differences in burr aggressiveness. I guess you could detect differences in grind distribution with sieve testing but I didn't want to do that.

All in all I'm happy with these modified Mazzers. I could spend a lot more money buying other 64mm flat burr grinders, some of which would offer extras like automatic variable dose dispensing. I don't need that for home use. Both grinders are more than 15 years old and are still running strong.

If I were to get another 64mm or larger burr grinder, I'd probably get a conical. Conical burrs, in my experience, produce espresso with different taste features, especially in regard to body and so-called "mouth feel." A good way to experiment with conicals is to get a reasonably good manual grinder with 48mm burrs. 1-zpresso makes several that are not too expensive.