Getting reacquainted with HB and hence this necropost.

Baldheadracing's OP is spot on. IMHO it should be stickied. Maybe that is wrong term. What I mean by stickied is put as 1st post under "buying advice " forum.

I would add to this thread
* If you can responsibly afford it, then "buy once cry once."
* If get lower performing equipment and this most often means lower cost, then to get consistent excellent espresso you will be fighting the equipment in some way. I prefer not to fight the equipment.

For those others reading and new to espresso let me explain my own decision with two single boiler dual use machines back in 2009. (a) Stock Gaggia Classic (single boiler dual use) w/o PID will require user be knowledgeable and require more user effort to get consistent excellent shot (e.g. temperature surf). vs. (b) QuickMill Alexia with PID. Latter PID is nearly set and forget. It still requires few seconds flush every few minutes. E61 grouphead has thermal mass to maintain temperature better too.

Another Orphan Espresso Pharos vs. Helor 106. I literally fought/struggled with Pharos (v1.1 and custom bench dogs) with light roasted beans (e.g. George Howell Costa Rica Dota or roast level Agtron 70 beans).

Ahhh! The things I wish I knew about child rearing before I was a dad; about plumbing before I replaced my water heater; about swimming before I jumped in the pool . . .

I wish us all a productive, error-filled journey.

I like James Hoffmans comments about transparency in the process. If you can do that, the beans shine through. If the beans are lousy, a transparent process will give you a lousy cup. If the beans are great, you can get a great cup. If your process is lousy, even with good beans the cup will be bad.

Yeah, there are lots of variables and things to consider, beans, water, grinder, process., Nail them all, awesome cup.

This is a great thread.

russel wrote:There is no substitute for the experience of tasting/drinking coffee (and a lot of it).

Adding to this idea, for people just learning how to make espresso, it helps to start with a good bean from a solid roster and stick to it until you can reliably pull good shots. Moving from bean to bean at the beginning can be confusing.

After that, I'm with Russel about trying an array of beans from an array of roasters. More of my education has come from this than anything else.

About "what is your time worth?" where modifications are concerned: I used to pull TVs apart and repair them when I was a kid (late 1960s - early 1970s). I also used to have a great chemistry set... later I learned how to build many things from wood, including a full set of exterior doors for my home. If you allow yourself to think and to research, many modifications take very little time. And if you're spending any time in front of a TV, the "what is your time worth?" question is kinda silly. Instead of watching reruns of The Kardashians, you could be modding your machine!

Good post, seemed to have missed it when it first passed through. I think eliminating as many variables outside of your own control is good practice when starting off. That means good equipment and good beans. This doesn't mean grab a $8000 setup immediately, but to wait and save up if budget is an issue getting into a consistent machine. If in a city, grab a cupping and barista class. This could possibly save you months!

ira wrote:The one comment I would have in the opening post is the grinder section. When I read it I see someone biased to lighter roasts. It neglects to mention the Monolith MC5 and the Versalab, both of which probably belong in their price classes for what they do. Lots of the noiser people here consider the Max, P100 and other 98mm grinders the current best, but for probably just as many if not more, the MC5 and VS will be better. I admire what you've done, but it seems biased a bit towards pulling lighter roasts without pointing out the bias except at the high end grinder level where it suggest 2 grinders in a place where I feel an MC5 might be a better choice. Same with the Decent, it's a fabulous machine, and I use it to pull amazing pourover/drip/what ever it's called, but fail at making espresso as good as my Brewtus. Do I blame the Decent, not at all, were I to decide it was important I'd figure it out, but it's overly complicated and a bit unfinished so maybe there are other choices at that level that ought to be included for people who just want to simply make great espresso, like maybe a Linea Micra?

Just some counterpoint.

Guilty!

Definitely great points. I wrote the post in June 2022 - before I knew that Shurikones, MC5's, Micras, etc. existed. I updated one entry in Jan 2023 as the machine I recommended seems to be no longer available, but did not change any of the text.

Note my disclaimer, though:

The coffee that you drink has a huge impact on grinder and machine choice. However, when I was starting out I couldn't answer that question well enough, so here are my sweeping generalizations ...

So I was considering the situation where someone wants to drink a variety of roast levels and coffees - for both grinders and machines.

For grinder, my thinking was that, at some point, grinders and burrs tend to do better with one roast degree vs. another, and so my opinion is that it is better to have two grinders than one grinder - when someone drinks a variety of roast levels and coffees. For example, for the Versalab, I didn't mention it as I was going by Titus' recommendation that their Hybrid 68 is not ideal for light roasts. I have no experience with the DRM burrset, but if a manufacturer tells people not to buy their DRM-burred grinder for light roasts (on kaffee-netz), then I'm not going to dispute that.

The choice of the decent was a choice that I was hesitant to make, as I have no desire to have one for multiple reasons. However, I do recognize that many people have them and keep them and enjoy using them, and that it is a very flexible machine. At the time, I couldn't think of a more flexible machine (stock) under $4k.

As an aside, originally I did not have categories over $2k, but added them as I realized how many people spend that kind of coin on their first espresso machine - and less than $1k on the grinder.

coyote-1 wrote:About "what is your time worth?" where modifications are concerned: I used to pull TVs apart and repair them when I was a kid (late 1960s - early 1970s). I also used to have a great chemistry set... later I learned how to build many things from wood, including a full set of exterior doors for my home. If you allow yourself to think and to research, many modifications take very little time. And if you're spending any time in front of a TV, the "what is your time worth?" question is kinda silly. Instead of watching reruns of The Kardashians, you could be modding your machine!

You're making a judgement, and I wasn't. I was asking the reader to answer that question for themselves. Many people enjoy modifying and fixing up and restoring equipment and learning and researching - that's a hobby. However, not everyone wants a hobby; some just want coffee.