HB wrote:Prosumer HX espresso machines don't perform as well under heavy loads, i.e., they usually need more recovery time than a similar E61 double boiler. Not to mention you go through a lot more water due to flushing. Then again, it depends if we're talking 4 consecutive drinks with a long pause or 6+ consecutive drinks with not much downtime. It won't matter if your production runs are only short bursts.

Thank you Dan for this information. Now I understand.
I think, I will probably get myself one Decent Espresso machine next year, hopefully in this coming Chinese New Year 2017. Really would like to try out what is called Temperature stability and pressure profiling.

HB wrote:Prosumer HX espresso machines don't perform as well under heavy loads, i.e., they usually need more recovery time than a similar E61 double boiler. Not to mention you go through a lot more water due to flushing. Then again, it depends if we're talking 4 consecutive drinks with a long pause or 6+ consecutive drinks with not much downtime. It won't matter if your production runs are only short bursts.

Are you saying 4 consecutive espressos is the breaking point on a prosumer HX?

It depends on how fast you are...

Speaking in general terms, if you're delivering one cappuccino every 90+ seconds, no problem. If you're delivering one every 45 seconds, the brew temperature will trend downwards and be entirely out of reasonable range by the fourth drink. These are only generalities; a Dragon will perform better than a Mixer under load (see Ideal brew temperature management by HX espresso machine type for details).

Prosumer espresso machines aren't made for serving a crowd. As a rough rule of thumb, they're great for 2-4 people, marginally acceptable for 6, and will run out of gas for 8. If you're preparing only espresso or very small cappuccinos, they'll do a little better. Two "big gulp" lattes or Americanos can kill their recovery time.

Really An eyes opening reading..... Thank you Dan once again here.

Thanks again for all your help. Much appreciated.

I will just sit tight and watch the used market for a good hx and run both (silvia and the hx) when the volume is required. I was just thinking aloud because the silvia is rather small compared a two group or even some high end single groups. I figure a single hx will provide a great daily upgrade and silvia will handle extra demand in the infrequent times.

So a broader question is - how does the home barista manage large groups of various drink requests? Is there an optimal setup?

Thanks again.

simplyred wrote:So a broader question is - how does the home barista manage large groups of various drink requests? Is there an optimal setup?

Thanks again.

A single group machine with a good sized steam boiler 2.5l or larger. HX or DB doesn't matter nearly as much when it comes to large volumes of milk bevs, available steam power and recovery is the limiting production factor.

simplyred wrote: So a broader question is - how does the home barista manage large groups of various drink requests? Is there an optimal setup?

Thanks again.

I solved that by getting a two group

In all seriousness whether you wind up with "double Silvias" or a used HX, when the need arises you would probably want to keep one of the Silvias on steam only duty and have the other machine pull shots. This way you don't have to wait for a Silvia to heat up or cool down to change modes.

dominico wrote:In all seriousness whether you wind up with "double Silvias" or a used HX, when the need arises you would probably want to keep one of the Silvias on steam only duty and have the other machine pull shots. This way you don't have to wait for a Silvia to heat up or cool down to change modes.

IF you do use a Silvia for dedicated steaming realize and never forget Missy does NOT have boiler auto-fill and you MUST manually keep the boiler filled with water or risk frying the heating element.

If considering two machines check to see you have two separate services to the breaker box. Running two of any Espresso machines on the same breaker will surely be an overload.

I regularly serve larger groups of people with my astra, and while it's not perfect, the 2.6l boiler makes short work of it. I can microfroth 6oz of milk in under 10 sec. Recovery is very fast. An Astra gourmet would be better, with the 4l boiler and rotary pump, but like I said, I've successfully served up to 50 people. My expobar failed miserably with its 1.8l boiler.